2020-03-21 15:28:33

aryamansingh wrote:

what cheers you a bit?

to find something that talks about this but not in the context of massive deaths but in the changes we might see, so, for example:

This current plague time might see a recharged commitment to a closer-to-the-bone worldview that recognizes we have a short time on earth, the Doomsday Clock is a minute from midnight, and living peacefully and meaningfully together is going to take much more than bed-making and canny investments. The Power of No Habits.
Some changes that are already taking place, like clear water in Venice's water canals... music, art and literature will be more important to society, at least in coping times more than ever, and so on.
Much of it is on the article I had posted back, it does not talk about any deaths or tragedies so if you want to read something that is different have a got at it. I did this because i do acknowledge that this will take time. Its necessary for that to happen as well because ultimately human greed which has been the cause for many way more terrible deaths, massacres, and other atrociousness needs to stop. IN other words, leaders will have to be on the same page, even if it is for a few years.

A bus station is where a bus stops. A train station is where a train stops. On my desk, I have a work station…

2020-03-21 16:14:40

Jayde wrote:

I really, truly hope that we learn from this, and that the world is never quite the same. However, the cynical part of my brain says that if this is halted sooner rather than later, capitalism will just come back, do its thing, and everyone will forget all the good things done in the name of social progress during a crisis.

I truely agree with you

want peace to be there everywhere around the world also I want an immediate sollution to be given for this war so that the bloodshed could be ended. live peacefully, let others also live peacefully

2020-03-21 16:16:59

UltraLeetJ wrote:
aryamansingh wrote:

what cheers you a bit?

to find something that talks about this but not in the context of massive deaths but in the changes we might see, so, for example:

This current plague time might see a recharged commitment to a closer-to-the-bone worldview that recognizes we have a short time on earth, the Doomsday Clock is a minute from midnight, and living peacefully and meaningfully together is going to take much more than bed-making and canny investments. The Power of No Habits.
Some changes that are already taking place, like clear water in Venice's water canals... music, art and literature will be more important to society, at least in coping times more than ever, and so on.
Much of it is on the article I had posted back, it does not talk about any deaths or tragedies so if you want to read something that is different have a got at it. I did this because i do acknowledge that this will take time. Its necessary for that to happen as well because ultimately human greed which has been the cause for many way more terrible deaths, massacres, and other atrociousness needs to stop. IN other words, leaders will have to be on the same page, even if it is for a few years.

very true

want peace to be there everywhere around the world also I want an immediate sollution to be given for this war so that the bloodshed could be ended. live peacefully, let others also live peacefully

2020-03-21 16:41:14

This generation might remember and be changed for the better, but the next generation who were not around to experience it probably won't. That is why history repeats, in my honest opinion.

2020-03-21 16:57:34

well here in the Philippines we have 307 cases (including the health chief), 19 deaths, and 13 recoveries.

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2020-03-21 17:05:20

in india also we have 300 cases with 5 deaths and 20 recoveries

want peace to be there everywhere around the world also I want an immediate sollution to be given for this war so that the bloodshed could be ended. live peacefully, let others also live peacefully

2020-03-21 17:33:09

Okay I've not been keeping up with all of the postts in this topic, but I have read the last few.

I confess, my lady's relatives in the states have mentioned this "conspiracy of blaiming china, which seems bonkers to me, especially considering how well China has actually coped with the virus, indeed for myself, I find it a hopeful sign that in China the rate of new cases is decreasing and the measures which other countries are putting into effect such as social isolation etc actually are having an effect. If anything china shows the rest of the world that there is a light at the end of the proverbial tunnel, and credit to them for that.

In Britain, on the one hand things are getting moderately crazier at the moment in terms of panic buying and most businesses now being closed, on the other, I'm actually surprised how well a lot of measures are! being put into place, from supermarkets highering extra staff and declaring certain shopping times for certain vulnerable groups like the elderly, or useful people like NHS workers and delivery drivers, to increasing measures enabling people to work from home, whilst the government is putting cash aside to help with redundancies.

Obviously, things are pretty grim, and the predictions are getting rather grimmer, from a predicted death toll between 20 and 250 thousand. However, on the plus side, the panic buying is slowly tailing off, and people just seem to be coping with things, indeed  some people are doing nice things in quite a small way, for example, some people are going shopping for eldily neighbors who can't themselves.

I am worried about both of my parents who are over 65, and desperately worried about Mrs. Dark, since she's just finished radio therapy. But on the other hand, my parents are both medics and quite able to practice good hygiene, and we're being as careful as we can, not taking stupid risks, washing our hands very regularly, avoiding contact with strangers, and being careful with shopping, indeed I bought a cupboard full of tins and dried goods and stocked the freezer three weeks ago, and at the moment will only need to go shopping for fresh things, which I will do given I'm less at risk than my lady is, and even then, as little as possible.

Oddly enough, whilst I'm certainly concerned about the virus, I don't feel panic at this point and am confident we can and will get through this, indeed my lady and I are probably better able to cope emotionally and psychologically with social isolation, ---- hay we're used to it, and introverts rule!

it will certainly get worse before it gets better, but the important thing is to remember that it will get better, stay calm, and do what needs to be done, and that's exactly what we, along with hopefully a hole lot of other people, are trying to do, as opposed to stupid social gatherings, panic buying, or even worse,  a game of pin the blaim.

With our dreaming and singing, Ceaseless and sorrowless we! The glory about us clinging Of the glorious futures we see,
Our souls with high music ringing; O men! It must ever be
That we dwell in our dreaming and singing, A little apart from ye. (Arthur O'Shaughnessy 1873.)

2020-03-21 17:43:20

@249, I know exactly how you feel.. I'm more street smart than book smart, and I'm sure some look down on me for that.
I would like to think that the world, let alone society would become better after this dies down.. My hopes aren't high, but my girl reads me random acts of kindness and they give me little glimmers of hope. I wish nothing but the best for whoever can read this, and think of you all when I break down my herbal, and prey at night.. Am I preying to nobody? I guess we'll see. Someone very close to me nearly lost an eye, but they get to keep it and are going to see out of it nearly 20/20. Also my good friend got results from her biopsy that she is 100% Cancer free.. Those two gifts helped me to reaffirm my faith a bit. We just gotta keep our minds sharp and our heads on a swivel..

2020-03-21 17:48:51

Yeah over here some stores are refusing to take in returned items which means those idiots who panic bought and have way more than what they need are plum stuck. That dude who bought over 17000 bottles of hand sanitizer that Amazon refused to sell because he jacked up the prices dead no choice but to donate it to charity ahead of a federal investigation that would have landed him in some hot water with several states that have laws against price gouging.

2020-03-21 20:10:33

There are companies who are price-gouging.
And seriously, there is a special dark place reserved for folks who would buy essential items on the cheap and then try to sell them in a crisis. That is...I don't even have the desire to express how slimy that is.

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https://www.dropbox.com/s/z8ls3rc3f4mkb … n.txt?dl=1

2020-03-21 20:23:03

Hell yeah, Jayde.. I agree 100% with that. They intended to profit on the panic, and thats morally reprehensible. If that was his intent, he deserves to be stuck with boxes of hand sanitizer that he can't return.

2020-03-21 23:17:58

This whole thing is so over-hyped that it's getting out of hand. The CDC has shown data that should give us all that we need to know with this. This virus, while dangerous, has only effected or killed a handful of people in comparison with the flu, which has now killed over 200,000 people this season. Why was there no panic about that? Yes, I know that this thing packs a serious punch and can kill people, but the truth is that there are thousands of other things that do more damage than this virus and our way of life has not come to a screeching halt over them. So, there's another virus floating around and it happens to be this thing called the Korona Virus. One thing to remember is that it isn't mortal to all who get it. Primarily, the elderly and those who have compromised immune systems are going to get the worst of it. Even then, there is a 98% cure rate, so there is nothing to be panicked about. There is no need to hold things like toilet paper, cleaning supplies, and other things of that nature. There is no need to have these shut-downs and such. In the end, we all need to remember that, virus or no virus, life goes on  and time stops for nothing. We need to keep living our lives in spite of this thing and apply common sense in terms of staying healthy. I've said it before, and I will say it agin. The real pandemic is not this virus, rather it is the way so many are reacting to it from the top down. Yes, I know that this thing has ben especially deadly in China and other countries. The thing to remember is that China has a population that dwarfs that of the United States and most of that population live pretty close together. Naturally, the virus would spread more quickly in areas like that. We can't start thinking that every country is going to have it as bad when not all living conditions are the same throughout the world. So, again there is absolutely no need for the level of panic this thing has caused.

2020-03-21 23:22:26

Here's an article which discusses the increased threat of domestic violence during these times.

https://jezebel.com/home-isnt-a-safe-pl … 1842409643

I'm going to keep harping on this point, because clearly, I'm not the only person who sees how devastating the social and emotional impacts of the virus are.

The glass is neither half empty nor half full. It's just holding half the amount it can potentially hold.

2020-03-22 01:43:19

@Jayde what is barbarism?
Also, I do hope this situation teaches society as a whole a lot of things. However, I'm not getting my hopes too high because if I know people, I know that in some cases, no matter what happens, people just don't learn and keep up their old habits that got us in this situation to begin with

2020-03-22 02:34:20

Well, I think in new zealand we are trying to stay ahead of the virus.
Europe and the us have a lot of catching up to do and so does australia.
No travel for me and well a few more have to stay home.
For me being a contract beta tester, 99.9% of my work is done online or at home.
True there are times I have to take a taxi to work but I hate doing so and only do it because pay is worth it.
Right now I can go to a cafe or other eatery, but that could mean I couldn't do that.
Mind you as far as locking down goes, it would probably be a good thing if that actually happened.
I have way to many destractions in my life.
I have a list of tasks longer than the transcyberian.
They include, finnishing a really boring flight sim pack.
Learning a new smart tv and an old iphone I got for cheap.
Getting my podcast back underway.
Catching up with some shows.
Reading several technical, audio and text ebooks.
And if I finnish all that, there is undead assault to play, getting back into swamp, and listening to some other audio dramas.
If I finnish that, I have a few adult online novels I need to get through.
And if thats all said and done, I can continue to test and eventually build a linux vm.
And if by some miracle I will be finnished with that,
I also have zoom, unigram and discord to learn.
And well if by then I am done and its not done yet then I'll be bored.
However I think we would need 10 years of isolation before I am even half way through my long life tasks.
And even if I get that done there is always my piano which I havn't played in 10 years.

2020-03-22 05:06:19

262, you obviously are not  reading the cdc's website correctly. Covid-19 is different from the flue in many ways, for one, humanity hasn't encountered coronaviruses before, so we have very little in the way of residual imunity.  Second, even after that, covid-19 has an average mortality rate between 2 and 3%. Sit and think about for  a minute. The CDC is projecting that  almost everyone will be infected by the coronavirus. Do you realize how bad that death tole could be? In the US that would be more than 7 million deaths. Contrast that with the flue, which only has a mortality rate les than 0.1%, and for which the population has a residual level of imunity.
263, what would you have  us do about the virus then? The government isn't responsible for indviduals commiting acts of violence. Nor should they use the lockdowns as justifications for their actions. The people who do such things likely  had  previously done such things before, or had a genetic  disposition to crime or violence. The fact of the matter is, the measures being put into place now are really conservative compared to what has to be done.  Not doing anything, regardless of what the justifications might be, as the UK has done up to recently will result in a situation worse than Italy, where they had government run healthcare. In the US, we don't have that, so  the outcome will be much more worse.

A learning experience is one of those things that say, "You know that thing you just did? Don't do that."

2020-03-22 05:56:36

@266, we actually have encountered them before. Covid-19 is not the only one around... SARS and MERS were also strains of coronavirus.

Discord: clemchowder633

2020-03-22 06:24:31

Remember the fact that MERS and Sars actually infected a really tiny number of people compared to covid-19. They were nowhere near as infectious. The number infected is in the low thousands.

A learning experience is one of those things that say, "You know that thing you just did? Don't do that."

2020-03-22 07:20:18

True. But still though, the fact is that coronaviruses are not a new thing.

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2020-03-22 07:48:10

in our country India public curfew has been imposed for 14 hours today it has started from 7 AM in the morning and will continue till 9 pm in the Evening

want peace to be there everywhere around the world also I want an immediate sollution to be given for this war so that the bloodshed could be ended. live peacefully, let others also live peacefully

2020-03-22 07:54:05

269, they are not true, but they are new in  a sense in that the majority of the world's population hasn't encountered them before.

A learning experience is one of those things that say, "You know that thing you just did? Don't do that."

2020-03-22 08:14:32

@266, I honestly don't know. There really is no right way to deal with it at this point. No matter what is or isn't done, we're all fucked. I think that's what bothers me the most about this, the fact that I have to roll over and give up before anything physically happens to me. I've never felt so helpless and alone, or questioned the way my life has played out, or wanted so strongly to be with the one person who actually tries to stay positive while everyone else around me inundates me with a constant barrage of apocalyptic predictions or, alternatively, shaming me for the choices I've made over the past couple of weeks to not completely isolate myself. I don't know why I ever thought that this wasn't serious. It doesn't matter what your religious or spiritual beliefs are, though I imagine that atheists are at peace right about now. I, however, have too much unfinished business here. I've made tons of mistakes, I've wasted years feeling sorry for myself, I've destroyed myself both physically and mentally. And, naturally, just as things were looking up for me, it was proven that it was never meant to be. And yet, the world is ending, there's no doubt about that, even if it's a slow burn rather than a big bang. We're not all going to be obliterated by a nuclear blast, though of course that would be more kind. No, all of us who have sinned, or have karma to repay, however you want to look at it, are going to suffer in the most cruel, drawn-out way possible. No democratic government is equipped to handle a crisis like this, since it's never happened before. The people aren't prepared to take orders from said government, even if they did everything right and didn't use their influence to do terrible things, like racial profiling and unnecessary force. There is truly no way out of this where the individual wins, but, more importantly, whatever social structure, fragile as it is in this society exists, it's pretty much gone now. Everyone's the enemy, since literally anyone could be a carrier.

The glass is neither half empty nor half full. It's just holding half the amount it can potentially hold.

2020-03-22 08:21:07

The overwhelming message that I keep seeing day by day is that the number of cases and deaths keeps rising exponentially in Italy, and they are now where the rest of the world will be in the coming weeks. Also, it will get worse before it gets better. Those are the two things I see at the end of every report I look at. Italy, with the world's best healthcare system now has more cases and deaths than anywhere else in the world, the United States will be next, and it will get worse before it gets better. Not sure what anyone's supposed to do with that other than stay home and watch the numbers get bigger. And look for toilet paper. And now apparently we have people filming themselves going from store to store coughing on everything they can find. It almost feels like most of the information that's being put out is meant to do little more than get people to feel outrage and panic and then pass it on.

2020-03-22 08:27:41

As I said, I would say it's a matter of keeping a clear head and neither belittling the threat, nor panicking like a fool.
No, the mortality rate in terms of   pure brute statistics is lower than something like saas, however the rate of infection is extremely high, and of course unlike the flue, there isn't enough a temporary vaccine.

Life is not a resource management computer game, you can't say "well I lost %2 of my population but hay, I still made it through that level." Since that two percent are people with human lives and families and connections to others, and might well include you or your friends and relatives.

That's why personally I'm focusing on getting through things, rather than prognostication. Yes, there will be some idiots, who panic buy or price gouge or the like, but there are also examples of people doing good things to cope as well, and in the end it's how we behave as individuals which will determine what happens on a social level, EG it will be far easier for governments to maintain social distancing rules if people actually do what they're told.

I remember once asking my gran what she did in the blitz, she replied "go to work, then go to the pub!" (she would have been 16 at the time), and now I think I know what she meant. big_smile.

On a larger level, I will say I do have some hopes that perhaps this thing will wake people up to the recent trends of factionalism, negativity and the like which the current culture has produced (largely I think due to corporate high handedness and lack of freedom, but of course as a socialist I would say that), but whether indeed this will happen, we'll just have to see, we still have the virus itself to deal with first.

With our dreaming and singing, Ceaseless and sorrowless we! The glory about us clinging Of the glorious futures we see,
Our souls with high music ringing; O men! It must ever be
That we dwell in our dreaming and singing, A little apart from ye. (Arthur O'Shaughnessy 1873.)

2020-03-22 09:31:31 (edited by magurp244 2020-03-22 09:37:30)

The flu has currently killed around 22,000 people this year, roughly 200,000 is more the global rate. Its a bit of a known metric, the issue with the Novel Coronavirus is we don't know much about it, its pathology or mortality rate in comparison, though currently its not looking good.

The incubation period for COVID-19 seems to be between 2 to 14 days and some infections can last up to 6 weeks, not taking into consideration on whether they can still infect people afterwards. There's also increasing evidence to support the idea that asymptomatic, pre-symptomatic, and mild cases [are contagious], enabling stealth transmission from those who never display symptoms. Whats more is it seems to be mutating through several different strains already, and can last on surfaces from hours to days. Severe cases hover around 20% with critical cases being 5%, children also seem [less likely] to develop serious symptoms. It also seems to have a high transmission rate.

The problem is that many nations, including the US and Canada don't have the supplies and tests to track and contain the outbreak, focusing instead on critical personnel and in/out-patients and vulnerable sectors. I know things seem grim but the important thing here is to stay calm. The worlds not going to end, but we do need to follow Quarantine Protocols until the virus runs its course and we can get this under control. Now would be a great time to pick up a hobby, learn a new skill, or take some online classes.

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