2012-04-19 10:37:33 (edited by SLJ 2012-04-19 10:49:27)

Hi all.

L-works is working on games for the iPhone, iPad and iPod touch. Well, that's the only thing I know yet. I saw it on twitter and it's also announced on l-works.net.
Personally I can't wait to see what's comming. Arcade multiplayer games or even Judgement day would be totally awesome. What are your thoughts?

Best regards SLJ.
Feel free to contact me privately if you have something in mind. If you do so, then please send me a mail instead of using the private message on the forum, since I don't check those very often.
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2012-04-19 11:20:46 (edited by robjoy 2012-04-19 11:21:55)

Hi,
Since he did not release any game yet, I think this is not the appropriate forum to post this topic in.
The interesting thing is, why did he stop developing for the pc when developing for IOS is equally, if not more, time consuming?
I have a feeling that he might be just testing things which does not necessarily mean that we'll see a game as a result.
Unless he takes an easy path, such as Corona, objective C is really a pain. However, Corona does not allow subtle audio handling, such as DirectX would, which he used. I'd personally would not vote for judgment day or even super Liam style games, not yet anyways.
Corona might have been enhanced since, and if this is the case, feel free to correct me.
Also, for the curious and freeware lovers, since IOS requires a developer fee, if he develops any game, it's almost certain that it won't be free.

Rob

----------
Robjoy, AKA Erion
Visit my site for all the things I do and to contact me.
You can also stop by for a slice of Pi

2012-04-19 13:02:58

It might be he is doing simple iPhone and iPad games such as Super Egg Hunt Plus and will use the method Richard De stenno has used to make his games available. I, for one,  would love to run my finger over the screen picking up eggs for a dollar or two.

2012-04-19 13:15:27

Haha, yeah, that would be great... big_smile

To see a world in a grain of sand, and a heaven in a wild flower.
Hold infinity in the palm of your hand, and eternity in an hour.
William Blake - Auguries of Innocence, line 1 to 4

2012-04-19 14:02:41

Hi.
I'm sorry if I've posted this in the wrong topic. The website says new games are comming, so I thought it would fit in here. I would move the topic if I could, so I hope the moderators will move it if required.
Personally I don't care about paying for IOS games if they are great. I think it's easier to make games for IOS but I can't speak for that. I'm sure that it's not harder though. Look how many games there are!
When the news says that games are comming, well, they are really comming. Otherwise Liam will be doomed forever! smile Who have ever said he has dropped the games for pcs? I wish people would be more positive about the news. Otherwise, we'll never get any games. smile
Hope to see more comments here.

Best regards SLJ.
Feel free to contact me privately if you have something in mind. If you do so, then please send me a mail instead of using the private message on the forum, since I don't check those very often.
Facebook: https://facebook.com/sorenjensen1988
Twitter: https://twitter.com/soerenjensen

2012-04-19 17:15:07 (edited by robjoy 2012-04-19 17:23:11)

Hi,
Oh I am positive smile, just I'd like to avoid the jumping to conclusions part too quickly situation smile
Quoting from l-works.net:

For over ten years I have been writing computer games for the visually impaired. during that time I have met a lot of great people who have enjoyed what I do. I'm proud to saythat I produced some excelent games that people enjoy to this day. However, my work and personal commitments keep me from being able to put the time in that is required to continue development.

As of now I will no longer be producing any future titles. All the current games on l-works.net will still be supported and I will honor requests for unlock codes. People may still purchase games if they haven't done so already, but there will be no updates or work done.

The next news entry is about IOS games coming soon... Isn't this a bit contradictory?
Still, I hope he'll produce something, if he has the budget for it.

Regarding audio game development being hard on IOS: First, you need to pay a developer fee. You still have to purchase sound libraries. The platform is a bit different, and you cannot really use the touchscreen in a way you would use the keyboard.
Then, programming languages. Objective C (which is the standard) is a lot harder than c++, which is a language known to be quite hard to grapple. We also have Corona, which is based on Lua. It is miles easier than OC, but it has its disadvantages as well.
There is Basic4PPC as well, I think, and they have mentioned they might extend their products to support IOS devices. But, this is not much. For windows you have hundreds and hundreds of programming languages, libraries written during twenty-or-so years, etc. On IOS you don't have this advantage.
Having said that, it is not impossible. But the number of applications developed for IOS certainly does not mean that developing for it would be easy. There are around 600 thousand apps for IOS. For windows, there are millions.
Well, we'll see how it goes. smile

Rob

----------
Robjoy, AKA Erion
Visit my site for all the things I do and to contact me.
You can also stop by for a slice of Pi

2012-04-19 21:16:02

Moderation!

The new releases forum is for actually newly released or at least discovered games. It doesn't matter if they are muds, or audio games, the crytical thing is that the topic points to something playable. This is I'm afraid more in the matter of speculation and previews thus far, hence why it doesn't belong there.

Leaving aside the fact that I don't at the moment have an Iphone or Ipad, (though I do plan to get one instead of a laptop when my current laptop busts), myself I'm not sure on this one.

On the one hand as Rob said, it does seem a little contradictory. On the other, since Ios devices imploy tilting, touch screen etc, if you wanted to make a smaller, more arcade like game that was at the same time interesting to play, Ios would be a way to go.

Say for instance that liam developed super Egghunt plus, but instead of hitting the arrows to move, you had to tilt the phone around in different directions to make your character run around, ---- or maybe point your finger in the direction of an egg and do repeated taps to run faster.

That would make for a much more interesting experience than an arcade pc game, and if you were a developer with less time but still the desire to make games, it might be a good way to go to insure you had something interesting to play without having to put in the big effort to create something like superliam.

Of course, there is still Rob's point both about the programming languages, and about the fees, ---- though since Liam is I believe a professional programmer in his own right, perhaps picking up the c based language for Ios would be less trouble.

As to fees, I also gather that though the developer fees for Iphone are annoying indeed, it does seem that on average Ios aps sell for much less than pc ones.

for example, Papasanga is I believe 8 dollars, where a similar game on pc would I'm sure be 15 at least.

Of course, price is dependent upon the state of the markit and the current prices being asked for other things which do not necessarily reflect production costs at all, (oftem something quite expensive to produce can sell for not very much), so we probably can't draw any conclusions either way.

Perhaps liam will make a more formal announcement than just one over twitter if he is serious about developement, since obviously that will also help him drumb up interest for his game, and at that point we will know a little more.

With our dreaming and singing, Ceaseless and sorrowless we! The glory about us clinging Of the glorious futures we see,
Our souls with high music ringing; O men! It must ever be
That we dwell in our dreaming and singing, A little apart from ye. (Arthur O'Shaughnessy 1873.)

2012-04-20 07:55:27 (edited by lauren.downie96 2012-04-20 07:56:09)

Hi,
Wow, if he ever makes a super egg hunt pluss on an IOS device, maybee you could do it like on the nightjar or papa sangre. Mind you, that could be copywrited by them. smile

It is better to remain silent and be thought a fool, than to open your mouth and remove all doubt. -Abraham Lincoln

2012-04-20 08:52:46

Rob: Ah, now I see your point. smile
I ment that Liam hasn't totally dropped his pc games, but he has just stopped developering new titles. The rumors says that he will finnish what he was working on, but who knows.
I thought IOS games were much easier to make than computer games. Otherwise it don't makes sense that he stopped making new games for pc because he don't have time to make them, and then begin to make games for IOS. Therefore I thoght it was easier.
Dark: thanks for clearing things up regarding the new released room. smile
I see lots of amazing features on the iPhone when it comes to audiogames.

Best regards SLJ.
Feel free to contact me privately if you have something in mind. If you do so, then please send me a mail instead of using the private message on the forum, since I don't check those very often.
Facebook: https://facebook.com/sorenjensen1988
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2012-04-20 09:33:37

@slj agreed about the Iphone, especially for people who like gamebooks, that's one of the major reasons why I'll probably get an Iphone or Ipad instead of a laptop next time.

@Lauren, you can't copywrite a game mechanic, such as a method of running in a game by pressing the screen, only the characters, sounds, situations and source code are copywrite.

to take an example from the mainstream, Mario kills enemies by jumping on their heads. So can sonic, Micky mouse in castle of ilusion for the Mega drive, bubsy the bobcat, zool the ninja ant, james Pond, and abou t a bazillion other computer game characters from the 16 bit platform era. This is all completely fine, as long as those characters don't include Mario, Luiji, bowser, princess toadstool etc.

to take an example from audiogames, Technoshock has virtually the same navigation and movement commands as shades of doom, but there is absolutely no problem with this as long as the source code of Technoshock hadn't been copied from shades of doom, and as long as Technoshock didn't use the name "shades of doom" or the character of the agent.

So it would be absolutely fine for Liam to use a control scheme similar to pappasanga or the Night Jar in an arcade game for the Iphone, just so long as he wrote all the source code himself and didn't borrow any characters from other games.

Hope this makes sence.

With our dreaming and singing, Ceaseless and sorrowless we! The glory about us clinging Of the glorious futures we see,
Our souls with high music ringing; O men! It must ever be
That we dwell in our dreaming and singing, A little apart from ye. (Arthur O'Shaughnessy 1873.)

2012-04-20 13:07:56

@dark
I wouldn't  use an iphone over a laptop, no way, in fact, I bet most ios users use both side by side.
I don't think that would be wise at all,
I use both, and would not be able to survive without either, they both do different things.
for example, extensive  word prossessing, I would never do on the iPhone, and all those audiogames on the pc?

2012-04-20 14:27:36

Actually robla, my brother has an Ipad, and since he works as a solicitor, frequently does word processing and note taking on it using a flip out keyboard, and most of the word processing I do (not counting my thesis), is after all fairly basic, just requiring something like wordpad.

As to games, that's why I'll still have a desktop pc, however what I mainly use my laptop for is music and audio books, as well as the occasional short game when i'm out and about, and an Iphone or Ipad can handle all of those quite well, and indeed not with the battery constraints my current laptop has.

no, I won't have access to my pc games, but I'll have Iphone ones, just the same way I don't have access to my Snes or gamecube games when I'm not at my flat.

The reason i have never actually got an Iphone (or indeed any specialized phone) up to now is precisely because! if I'm out long enough to have one, odds are I'd have my laptop with me, thus making an Iphone quite redundent in many respects, but once my laptop explodes, I will make the switch for precisely the same reason.

With our dreaming and singing, Ceaseless and sorrowless we! The glory about us clinging Of the glorious futures we see,
Our souls with high music ringing; O men! It must ever be
That we dwell in our dreaming and singing, A little apart from ye. (Arthur O'Shaughnessy 1873.)

2012-04-20 16:22:01

I could never go completely without an actual computer precisely because of audio games. Because quite frankly there aren't really any Ipad/IPhone games that have come out that grab my interest and I therefore absolutely MUST attempt to play. he only one was Silversword and I'll be surprised if we ever see that game made completely Voiceover friendly after the developer was basically harrassed by a member of the comunity. As for Liam I guess we'll have to wait and see. Because if he no longer has time to develop for the PC I don't see how he'd have time to develop for IOS.

But wait, what's that? A transport! Saved am I! Hark, over here! Hey nonny non, please help!

2012-04-20 17:59:15

Oh, I understand, I thought your laptop was your primary pc, but that now makes sence

2012-04-20 18:03:48

In my case it actually is. LOL. I sort of miss having a Desktop, but in my current place I've had nowhere to put one, at least up until recently.

But wait, what's that? A transport! Saved am I! Hark, over here! Hey nonny non, please help!

2012-04-20 18:31:44

@Robla fair enough, I agree substituting an Iphone for a full on computer would not be a good move, what I want it for is! precisely to be portable.

@Bryan, in terms of Iphone games, there are several that look interesting to me, especially in the gamebooks catagory, and even more especially King of Dragon pass. It will also help working for this site if I have access to an Iphone obviously, since then I'll be able to write up entries for games, ---- though that is by no means the only reason I'm getting one.

i'm not sure what went on with Silver sword, though I gather a certain person from audeasy was less than polite. Again, if I got an Iphone I might attempt a little reason as I've worked with developers before on such things, but we'd have to see, ---- for a start I will need to get used to using voice over and the touch screen, though I don't believe that is impossible.

Either way though, this is a ways off, since my laptop is currently working fine and probably will do for a year or two yet, ---- though if it happens that I end up at music school somewhere else and thus will be commuting up and down the country a lot more, I might get an iphone for all those train journeys, leave my laptop at my parents' in Nottingham and my pc up here, though again, that isn't something to considder for several months yet.

With our dreaming and singing, Ceaseless and sorrowless we! The glory about us clinging Of the glorious futures we see,
Our souls with high music ringing; O men! It must ever be
That we dwell in our dreaming and singing, A little apart from ye. (Arthur O'Shaughnessy 1873.)

2012-04-20 23:57:45 (edited by BryanP 2012-04-21 20:43:31)

Yep, it was an Audyssey member who failed to realize that, having only just become aware of the concept of accessibility in his game, the developer hadn't had enough time in just a week or two to make any changes, let alone any significant ones. So when that member wrote him again, particularly after having been asked politely not to raise the issue again since the dev had already decided which of the suggested ideas he was going to attempt to implement, it probably just pushed his buttons one more time too many. From what I've heard since then he's pretty much ignored all subsequent emails about the issue. He did seem willing at first but not anymore. And make sure you don't have a signature on your message that seems to advertise anything, because that was another thing that apparently rubbed him the wrong way.

But wait, what's that? A transport! Saved am I! Hark, over here! Hey nonny non, please help!

2012-04-23 08:47:00

Hi.
The latest news tells that Liam is makeing a game called Audio Archery. A very simple game where you have to tilte the phone to center a sound, and just swipe down to shoot. Well, I had hoped for a game which has more replayability! Lets see how it works, but if it's a paied game, I'll only pay if it has multiplayer support.
Read the whole news on l-works.net.

Best regards SLJ.
Feel free to contact me privately if you have something in mind. If you do so, then please send me a mail instead of using the private message on the forum, since I don't check those very often.
Facebook: https://facebook.com/sorenjensen1988
Twitter: https://twitter.com/soerenjensen

2012-04-23 15:30:22

@Bryan some people just don't have good social skills, but it's sad when that impacts on vi gaming generally, that's why i always try to take considderable care when i'm working on access with a developer myself.

@slj, I personally don't care overmuch about multiplayer, for me it'll depend upon how the game plays, what extra options it has etc, though I can certainly see the Iphone being a good place for an arcade game since it will doubtless take more practice and coordination to center and targit physically than just by pressing keys, ---- but we'll have to see.

We also don't know the price yet, and while I probably wouldn't pay too much for an arcade game, if it was only a small cost, say 3 or 5 usd i might considder it if the game was of reasonably good sound quality and playability, but all of these things are things we won't know until the game is finished, ---- and indeed I won't know them until i get an Iphone big_smile.

With our dreaming and singing, Ceaseless and sorrowless we! The glory about us clinging Of the glorious futures we see,
Our souls with high music ringing; O men! It must ever be
That we dwell in our dreaming and singing, A little apart from ye. (Arthur O'Shaughnessy 1873.)

2012-04-23 16:54:24

Hi,
Most simple games cost around 60 or so pence in the uk maybe the £1.19 mark too.

2012-04-23 16:56:34

Wow Aaron, that's less than I thought, and certainly not unreasonable for an arcade game.

With our dreaming and singing, Ceaseless and sorrowless we! The glory about us clinging Of the glorious futures we see,
Our souls with high music ringing; O men! It must ever be
That we dwell in our dreaming and singing, A little apart from ye. (Arthur O'Shaughnessy 1873.)

2012-04-24 01:52:24

I cannot wait until this thing comes out. Although I have a laptop, I don't bring it everywhere I go. I go to a social gathering of blind students, and usually I take my iPhone and nothing else; the downside is that I cannot swap files with others. Still, a high quality audiogame on the iPhone would be nice. I think the reason that we haven't seen one yet is because the iPhone dev libraries are inaccessible (or so I've heard). I wonder how liam is developing for IOS?

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Feel free to add me.

2012-04-26 17:46:40

Hi.
Well, I'm getting an Ipad soon, and i'm really looking forward to playing these ios games. But, I have one question.
If liam is developing games for ios, doesn't that take about as much time as developing them for the pc? If so, why isn't he developing games for the pc anymore, when developing games for ios takes just as much time?

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2012-04-27 08:53:29

Hi.
I don't know why he's making IOS games instead computer games, when he have said he don't have time to make computer games. That was the reason for I thought games for IOS was much easier to make. Sounds pretty weird.

Best regards SLJ.
Feel free to contact me privately if you have something in mind. If you do so, then please send me a mail instead of using the private message on the forum, since I don't check those very often.
Facebook: https://facebook.com/sorenjensen1988
Twitter: https://twitter.com/soerenjensen

2012-04-27 09:35:06

As I said slj, my personal thought on this isn't to do with relative difficulty, but with interest. We know it is easier to make a sterrio targiting arcade game than something like superliam, however if Liam released a sterrio targiting arcade game on pc just using the keyboard I don't think anyone would exactly be thrilled about it. By using the analogue control on the Iphone though, Liam can create an arcade game that is at the same time unique to play because of it's controls, rather the way aprone did with daytona.

ultimately though unless Liam himself explains why he made the game we won't know, and I doubt he'll be doing that until it is completed.

With our dreaming and singing, Ceaseless and sorrowless we! The glory about us clinging Of the glorious futures we see,
Our souls with high music ringing; O men! It must ever be
That we dwell in our dreaming and singing, A little apart from ye. (Arthur O'Shaughnessy 1873.)