2020-09-29 06:57:48

hello
it has come to the time where I need to get a new computer because my old one was a piece of shit. now, I’m debating on a couple options but I’d like to know if there are more. I do not want to turn this into a Mac versus windows thing but I was thinking of getting a MacBook Air. But on the other hand I was also thinking of getting A surface Pro. The reason I want to choose one of these computers is because of their portable nature. Many people have told me that macOS isn’t the best but I was going to install windows on it anyways. I would’ve used the Mack OS side of it for something but it really doesn’t matter. The criteria for the computer i choose are as follows. It Hass to be lightweight and portable so that I can take it around to places like the park or a café when those open up again and it Hass to be decent in terms of processor and RAM capabilities. If you think there are other computers that I would like please let me know

2020-09-29 07:42:08

Good morning.

If you decide to go the Mac side in combination with Windows, I would shell out the extra money and get a MacBook Pro instead of the Air.

You see, I currently have a MBA for testing and if you do more intense things with it, you really notice that it's just a machine for light work such as surfing, word processing and what not.

Also, if you say that the machine should have decent performance, do keep in mind that if the computer has to be light weight and portable, you will always have compromises.

The 2020 MBA has an i7 configuration for example, but when you run it through benchmarks, it can't even use all the power the i7 has to offer and the machine starts throttling immediately.

The MacBook Pro, or MBP is also as portable as the MBA, maybe half a centimeter thicker than the MBA, but has more processor cores and the cooling unit is generally positioned better, so you can actually use the performance the machine has to offer.

If you want to dual boot, get a large enough SSD, or put Windows on an external SSD if that is possible.

I haven't checked the surface pro, but again, if you need more performance, try looking at the surface book. The most recent one is the Surface Book 3, but reading reviews, the version 2 is still as performant as ever and the new one doesn't really hold any advantages, so you can get the v2 for cheaper.
Hope I could help a bit.

Greetings moritz.

Hail the unholy church of Satan, go share it's greatness.

2020-09-29 08:33:38 (edited by defender 2020-09-29 08:57:33)

Simba has it right.  The smaller the laptop and longer the battery, the more limited the CPU will be.  Not to mention it will be more expensive and harder to repair.
You can find laptops that are under 2.5 pounds and run for a whole day, but they can't handle much more than a couple of web apps without lagging, and forget having allot of programs open at once.
Unfortunately, you'll just have to make a compromise between weight and power.  However the gap is shrinking more and more lately.  These days, you can get a laptop under 3.5 pounds and less than 3 quarters of an inch thick and 12 inches wide that does everything a 15 inch 5.5 pound 1 and a quarter inch laptop could do 5 years ago, and you'll get half again as much battery life out of it too.

2020-09-29 09:45:14

I would also help if you could give us some more details on what you want to do.

You say that you need decent performance, but some of the tasks you want to achieve would be good to know.

Greetings Moritz.

Hail the unholy church of Satan, go share it's greatness.

2020-09-29 13:18:14

mainly my tasks include programming and writing

2020-09-29 13:44:22

@5 If its just programming and writing, i'd say the MBA is a pretty good choice.
I've had a macbook air, and i even did things such as virtualmachines on it. There was only one situation when my MBA crashed, but it was more of my own fauld then the air's

Proud contributor to the manjaro project! www.manjaro.org

2020-09-29 16:07:56

If programming means JavaScript or Python, anything is fine.  If programming means Java, C#, or something else compiled you really, really want something more powerful.  To put this in perspective, I've got the typical overpowered programmer tower with 6 cores and a super fast SSD and all that, and something like Synthizer (C++, 10000 lines or so including dependencies) takes around 30 seconds to build from scratch.  If I was doing it on an Air...well, I can't imagine doing it on an air.  This may not sound so bad, but keep in mind that programming often means that you change 5 lines and rebuild the entire thing, you really don't want the edit-compile-run cycle to be slow.

If you're only going to run Windows, Macs tend to be overpriced and you can probably get a better deal by shopping around.

While the ultra-thin laptops seem really cool, going an extra half centimeter thicker and maybe up to a 15 inch or 17 inch can get you all the way to what is basically a portable workstation that's only 5 pounds and fits in a backpack, if you want to push it that far.  Not saying you should, just that laptops have come a long way and it's still a lot more portable than you're giving it credit for.

My Blog
Twitter: @ajhicks1992

2020-09-29 17:00:57 (edited by Sage_Lancaster 2020-09-29 17:01:48)

@camlorn it’s not just python and JavaScript. I will be using c# and dart. The reason I thought of a Mac was because of mobile app design. I know how strict Apple is about where you can design apps for their platform. Also the reason I wanted something light and thin is because I’m going to be going out a lot more and I’d like to take my computer with me

2020-09-29 17:11:33

Yeah, if you want to do iOS then a mac is mandatory.  But light and thin, 1-2CM thick is pretty light and thin.

For app dev you don't want an Air though.  You can, but things like dart likely fall on the "expensive to compile" side of the equation, and things like Swift and C/C++ definitely do.

My Blog
Twitter: @ajhicks1992

2020-09-29 17:19:17 (edited by mazen 2020-09-29 17:23:38)

Lenovo thinkpad X 1  carbon gen 8 maybe grate

2020-09-29 17:20:05

I guess I could get a MacBook Pro

2020-09-29 17:23:12 (edited by Aron Leppik 2020-09-29 17:24:29)

I have a mac book air. I don't really like it. I'd say go with something that Camlorn said. Yeah sure this thing is portable and cool and all, but you don't really get any performance out of it + I paid a lot for this when it came out. Thinking of giving this to my sister and buying something that can handle a lot of stuff. I'll keep my eye on this.
Fun fact: I haven't booted up OSX for about 6 months now.

"Hello Jerry."
"Hello Newman."

2020-09-29 17:54:50

Don't get a MacBook right now.
Mostly due to the new silicon that will be added to the Mac, it'll probably be wiser to wait. You're probably not going to be able to program for Windows on it, but it'll future-proof way better than current ones.
That being said though, I still can't recommend the Mac for programming because of how awful Voiceover is in the terminal. There have been many times where I have compiled something and VoiceOver skips errors.

A winner is you!
—Urban Champion

2020-09-29 18:19:46

I have an HP notebook, I forget its exact specs. Got it in 2017, late in the year. 16GB of RAM, one of those nifty dual drives that's half SSD and half HD or whatever. Its speakers aren't amazing, but I use headphones most of the time. Its built-in keyboard is awful, but I bought a twenty-three-dollar external keyboard that's been working for me for almost two years running now, and shows no sign of giving up the ghost just yet. Extra bonus there is it lets me run the laptop while it's shut, which significantly improves its battery (we're talking 7-9 hours of continual use running audio, web-surfing, writing, gaming). The whole thing is about three and a half pounds, I think, and fits comfortably into a backpack with no issues at all. The only part I've had to replace is the keyboard (see above).

I feel like for your purposes, getting something that's a bit beefier than mine but still not a beast would do you best.

Check out my Manamon text walkthrough at the following link:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/z8ls3rc3f4mkb … n.txt?dl=1

2020-09-29 18:44:52

Whatever you do, get a computer with an SSD. Don't bother with those stupid hybrid drives or a regular HDD. Once you use an SSD, you'll never want to go back to a spinning drive.

Everything else is up to you. Get something with at least 8 GB RAM and an i5 processor. If you think you'll need more power, go for 16 or more GB RAM and an i7 CPU.

Grab my Adventure at C: stages Right here.

2020-09-29 19:15:17

My hybrid is lovely. Boots in about seventeen seconds and I've never noticed appreciable lag from it.

Also, went digging, and the model I have is an HP Pro-book 440-G5.

Check out my Manamon text walkthrough at the following link:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/z8ls3rc3f4mkb … n.txt?dl=1

2020-09-29 19:17:25

@jayde have you ever had to use it for resource intensive tasks? And if so how did it handle them?

2020-09-29 19:33:35

I have a Mac book pro 2016, and that thing is like the airs when it comes to the size. I really don't like using it because it will get verry hot stupid fast.

2020-09-29 21:25:16 (edited by defender 2020-09-30 06:53:42)

If you are really truly serious about making mac or IOS apps, than yeah I'd go with a 15 inch Macbook Pro 2019 model, since unfortunately the only 13 inch model they have right now is quite out of date and definitely not worth the money, and the 2020 16 inch Macbook Pro is even more crazy expensive and not actually allot different. You can get an I7 or even I9 processor, but save money by going with a 256GB SSD , which should be enough for what your doing.  If you are in school, you should also be able to get education pricing through them, and going with certified refurbished can help too.
Otherwise, you can spend allot less and get better hardware and repairability for the price with a Windows laptop.
It's not an easy choice for sure.  The mac is definitely more flexible and devalues  allot slower if you want to sell it down the line, but it will get outstripped by other machines more quickly too, while a Windows computer would keep up better but might die prematurely do to lower quality hardware, and you'd have to spend extra to get even a second hand, slower Mac to code Apple apps on if you decide you want to do both later.

2020-09-29 22:22:56

Programming is the most intensive resource intensive task that exists, depending on what you're doing.  If you're very serious about programming, get the best CPU and SSD you can afford and at least 16GB of ram.  If you're not sure how serious about programming you are yet, you can get away with less.  But Synthizer uses all cores of my machine when it builds for however long it takes, and work's codebase (when built from scratch) takes a rather powerful VPS upwards of half an hour at full utilization.

So it boils down to this: are you learning to program because you think you might like it, or are you going to stick with it for 5-10 years and it's going to become your job?  if the latter, you need power.  Even my frontend friend who just does JS hates his slightly underpowered computer because it takes time from him hitting save in the file to being able to view it in his browser.  I promise that if you do this for long enough, when you inevitably arrive at the point where you spend longer waiting on the build than actually checking if the bug is fixed, you'll regret the underpowered but portable machine and want to smash it with a hammer.

My Blog
Twitter: @ajhicks1992

2020-09-29 22:41:31

@camlorn in the future after I get my computer science degree I plan to take up programming as a job although based on what I’ve heard it makes programming a lot less fun but I don’t care about that right now. I think I can afford a lot. My budget is around $3000 because that’s what I have saved up so far. I remember the last time I tried to get a cheap computer and it didn’t go well which is why I saved up for it this time

2020-09-29 23:04:40

Hi.

At Defender small correction there.

The most recent 13 inch MBP was released in the first months of 2020, so I wouldn't count that to be out of date. There are 2 configurations, one runs with the older 8 gen i5 and i7 processors, the beefier one runs with the the new 10 Gen chips if I remember right.

The 16 inch one is from last year and while it's more expensive, the basic configuration is a lot better compared to the other MacBooks around, and if you search, you can get it for cheaper.

At OP if I were you, I would look at the MBP 13 inch 2020.

Greetings Moritz.

Hail the unholy church of Satan, go share it's greatness.

2020-09-29 23:05:15

$3000 gets you a *lot*.  I would have trouble spending that much on a laptop.  I could do it, but I'd have to check all the boxes and it would be beyond anything I personally need (for example, programmers don't benefit from a GPU outside specific domains).

The CS degree may or may not make programming less fun, but the salary makes up for it and I think it would be more accurate to say that getting paid for doing anything that you used to do as a hobby probably makes it at least a little less fun.  If you're the right sort and in the right situation, a CS degree can actually be quite enjoyable: CS people are on the forefront of basically everything now, up to and including really big questions like "what is thought".  Indeed in regards to that specific example, philosophers have nothing on OpenAI employees, who are probably very much "Machines can't think? Hold my beer..." these days.  On the one hand you've got "it's all math and this sucks", on the other one of the introductory proofs most people do is "here is an example of a question that cannot be answered that we'd actually like to have an answer for. No, not even by god.", and then there's "And also some infinities are bigger than others, watch this", usually in the same class.

My Blog
Twitter: @ajhicks1992

2020-09-30 00:03:22

I remember in one instance in the synthizer thread I think where you said working as a programmer made it a bit less fun for you. I could be wrong though. Sorry for dragging the subject off topic but I don’t like apples strictness of having to have a Mac to code on their platform. I mean look at Google and android. You don’t have to buy an android PC or a Chromebook in order to code for android

2020-09-30 00:11:04

O sure it has. Not saying that's not the case.  It's my nature that anything I have to do on deadlines for a roof or whatever is going to be less fun, and many others are that way, maybe even most people.  But it could have been almost anything else, there's not something inherent to CS that makes CS worse unless you go off and end up on call 24/7 or something somewhere (but then every other field has terrible jobs too, as well).  And it's not the degree itself that makes it less enjoyable, either.

Think about it like this: would you give up 20% of your programming enjoyment in exchange for being able to retire young and afford everything you could ever want?

My Blog
Twitter: @ajhicks1992