2020-05-05 16:14:01

No, intelligence agencies have virtually carte blanche to do what they want, so if anyone was going to do this, it'd be a state intelligence agency. If the ability to scrape fully over a system did exist, then....I'd put good money on the NSA/CIA/KGB/GCHQ/NKVD/whoever having access to it and using it and nobody even knowing until the whistle is blown however. That's what I think, the intelligence community already quite probably has that tech and nobody knows about it, then one day somebody blows the whistle and it's revealed that for the past 20 years your data's actually being siphoned off to <insdert intelligence agency here>

After all, it has happened in the past, and various agencies have who knows what. If they could scrape from webcams/mics it'd be a goldmine of intel being gathered without needing to put people in a dangerous spot.fro

Warning: Grumpy post above
Also on Linux natively

Jace's EA PGA Tour guide for blind golfers

2020-05-05 17:28:24

Camlorn wrote:

Okay, look, guys.  It costs a ridiculous amount of money to do speech recognition at scale reliably, and even when they do it can't reliably detect what you're saying when you speak clearly in a quiet room to your Google Home or whatever.  And we can barely build a reliable barcode scanner app that doesn't need to be lined up perfectly, and barcodes are *explicitly* designed to be scanned.

Speech recognition is the most accurate I've ever seen it. From my experience, these smart devices have no trouble understanding people. If it can get my name right (and it does,) I'd say it's pretty damn good.

Recently I had one of my friends go through their Alexa account just to see what data Amazon is storing. There were so many clips that were marked "not for Alexa" but that were stored on their Amazon account that I lost count of how many. And the voices in the recordings were crystal clear--all the way from across their house, to the point where even I could understand what was being said in the recordings, with my hearing problem.

Just like some of us take the "it's not possible approach" because it seems impossible, others of us say it is indeed possible that data collection is happening on orders of magnitude higher scales than we know about. Images are being transmitted everywhere and cameras are talking to one another (and transferring image files, which are very large.) How do I know this? Well, if you go to a foreign country, enough of your identity is pulled up about you just by facial recognition. Nowadays you don't even need to pull out your passport and foreign agencies know where you live just by scanning your face (this is from experience.)

Data transfers are getting faster and bandwidth is increasing to the point where what used to slow down residential Internet just ten years ago now doesn't even cause it to hiccup. So yeah, it's entirely possible. We've been kept unaware because we believe in the mediocrity of technology, but this is exactly what the data collectors want from us.

If you have an Alexa, check out your Amazon account when you get some time and you'll be shocked at how many small recordings are stored of you--all without your knowledge. Once my friend discovered this, they finally listened to me and got rid of their smart technology. Especially after one of the recordings was of them and their significant other having sex...

2020-05-05 17:36:31

Anyway...  I think I satirically overdid 14, but the point still stands.  Data collection has been a thing since the dawn of time; the difference now is in how it is collected and how it is shared and even who it is shared with.  That techniques have advanced to the point and level where we are now is honestly amazing on so many counts.  Yes, it freaks me the blazes...
I've told this story elsewhere on the forum, but when I first signed up for google Plus it recommended three people two me almost automatically as people who's activities I should follow up on.  One of them was a close friend of mine, the other was simply a person I'd heard of but had never spoken to, while the first recommendation on the list?  Jason Alan.  Many of you may be aware, that Jason Alan, of course, is the guy who developed Entombed.
So, yes, I"ve been aware of giant company's data collection practices for quite some time now.  Why do they not worry me?  Simple: I'm not going to lose any sleep over what multi-billion dollar companies collect on me because, whoever my true enemies are?  They are not standing on the top rungs of a corporate ladder getting ready to dish that information out to the world to make me look like the greatest chunky funky monkey that lived throughout the past 32 years.  I've already accepted the fact that I myself will more than likely never be a millionaire let alone anything richer than that, that I'll probably never be taken seriously in political circles, that whatever advocacy I strive for will more than likely be limited and that more than likely it will just be more like seed planting rather than the harvest, and that my job is to influence people and push them forward rather than taking the front seat myself unless I absolutely have to.
But more to the point?  Unless I'm honestly doing something I houldn't be?  I really have nothing to worry about!  My screen reader could just as easily send that information out to someone if that were the case, as could any online gaming platform I've visited in the past decade.  If they're not bothering, I don't see what, precisely I have to fear from a tech giant that could have me wiped off the face of the earth, with or without my data.
Could they sell it?  Sure.  Could someone closer to me buy it?  Maybe!  Might I have to explain myself when someone asks why I listened to baby shark well over a thousand times?  Possibly.  Will there be a public tweet or post on twitter or FB I'm going to be ashamed of?  Nah, not really.  Call it naiveness, idiocy, ignorance; whatever you like, but I'm not going to hide under a blanket doing little less than nothing because I'm convinced big brother is watching me and he's going to turn right around and disable my phone the day I go out on an O&M trip trying to find a store or restaurant or bank or whatever.  My life is far, far too simple to be the target of nefarious schemes involving behemoth conglomerations and closed door backroom deals where I'm the center of attention.  Honestly?  AT this point, I'd almost welcome a bit of spotlight; hey, Apple, are you listening?  Spotlight!

When life gives you oranges, demand lemons since everyone else is obviously getting them.

2020-05-05 18:35:51 (edited by Dakonna 2020-05-05 18:36:58)

I think for most people it's not a question of corporate control, but government control. Tech and software companies don't run the risk of actively undermining or circumventing your rights as a person, they just want more money. If mining your data makes their bottom line longer and there's nothing to prevent them from doing so, they'll do it. And since you're technically not forced to use their apps or technology, and since you agreed to all of what they're doing when you signed up to their service, it's your problem in their point of view. Where things get far more problematic is if state governments get free passes to all of your data, and if they somehow acquire the power to forbid you from doing certain things based on that data. That's what's happened in China, and now that these systems are in place over there, there isn't much that will put a stop to it. If you live in China you can't choose to just opt out of the social credit system. You're a citizen, so you have to use it. You can opt out, or flattly refuse to sign up to, things like Facebook or Amazon.

I used to be a knee like you, then I took an adventurer in the arrow.

2020-05-05 19:48:24

And that's why I always have the audible alerts on on my home speaker, so I know when it misfires and may record a few seconds of not-for-Google clippage.
Also, as far as China is concerned, they don't even need the super-advanced technology for the facial recognition goldmine.
Tiktok, WeChat, QQ (since it's international now) all have direct ties to the Chinese Government. Kids willingly post their 60seconds of fame on Tiktok blissfully unaware that they are selling their soul to this giant corporation that is courting U.S. gen-z's precisely because! they probably care more about accidentally going ridiculously overviral more than they do the royalty-free, all rights reserved license they have just given to the company. Same with the Russian facetuning app hoax. All these apps have ties to an intel agency and unsuspecting users jump right in, because making myself look different in several different configurations is more important than preserving my data.

2020-05-05 19:56:24

jack wrote:

And that's why I always have the audible alerts on on my home speaker, so I know when it misfires and may record a few seconds of not-for-Google clippage.

Hate to break it to you but even that won't help. These devices work by constantly sampling the surrounding audio in small buffers that they rotate out. Usually, the devices determine that they're just hearing ambient noise so they discard the buffers. But every now and then they'll choose to send voice recordings to the cloud for analysis if they detect that it "might be" for them but aren't entirely sure. Your device doesn't simply start listening when you hear the "ding" sound, it's always awake and listening. That's why you can shout at it to "wake it up," but that phrase "wake it up" is misleading and is a clever marketing scheme to trick you into thinking that as long as it didn't ding, it's not listening.

As an example, one of the clips we found on my friend's Alexa was five seconds or so and was of me and him talking, about an hour ago. Neither of us heard the "ding" that Alexa makes to let you know it's waiting for a response.

2020-05-05 20:51:35

I personally am mostly fine with Amazon and Google collecting my data. I get better search results that way. smile Being careful with privacy stuff is fine, but I think too much paranoia doesn't help either.

We are pleased, that you made it through the final challenge, where we pretended we were going to murder you. We are throwing a party in honor of your tremendous success. Place the device on the ground, then lay on your stomach with your arms at your sides. A party associate will arrive shortly to collect you for your party. Assume the party submission position or you will miss the party.

2020-05-05 22:08:09

Just to say again I downloaded these podcasts/radio shows a long time ago because I was a fan and like to keep stuff on an external HDD. I called them podcasts, but a lot of them are just recordings of the entire radio show that have been file-shared on the web. But anyway, I listened to another one earlier and here's the latest coincidence. The two guys were talking about the wombles, which is a british kids TV show from the 70s I think, and they also mentioned Wind in the Willows, another kids TV show from the same era. In my recs now I have The wombling song by the wombles, and a clip from Wind in the Willows. Kids tv shows from the 70s isn't something  I have searched for, and these are the only two examples of such in my recs. Obviously now I'm actually looking for this stuff, confirmation bias could come into play, but all the same, these coincidences are pretty creepy, if that's what they are.

2020-05-06 00:10:11

People think I'm weird because I don't always have my face buried in my phone on IG and Snapchat. Recording every fucking moment they think might get them approval from everyone else. It's stupid. I'm almost 20 years old and yet I feel like an old man. I even see people older than me doing this shit so really that part might be irrelevant.

2020-05-06 07:22:55

Its not just amazon that dnes this, or google? Have hey Siri enabled? Anyone? There, that's one more that does this. Voicecontrol is another. I could give a whole lot of examples, but will stop there. However; experience has taught me this; the people at the top, weather intelligence agency or whatever, those who run the world; do not have our best interests at heart, their actions are enough proof of this.

sound designer for mental vision, and Eurofly3.
take a look at
My freesound pageWhere I post sounds I record. ps: if you use my sounds, remember to credit me smiley

2020-05-08 10:52:13

aint that the truth. Most people don't care about you, or there costumers, just money and surviving another year with their stock somewhere decent.

2020-05-08 18:36:05

Sorry if this poast makes me look stupid, but seriously, amazon or google are collecting your data, who cares?
There are at least 1 million people using amazon and google products. Imagine how many staff you'd need to look through all that data.
No matter how many staff amazon or google has, it wouldn't be enough ot look through all your google searches, ETc.
So yeah.

My main interest is tech.
Follow me on twitter if you would like, my username is @stealthy153

2020-05-08 18:41:16

@37 this is precisely why large tech companies with big data sets use algorithms to search all this data and personalise what you see, or rather, what you're allowed to see.

I used to be a knee like you, then I took an adventurer in the arrow.

2020-05-08 19:53:49

That's my point, it's just computers analysing your data, not humans.

My main interest is tech.
Follow me on twitter if you would like, my username is @stealthy153

2020-05-08 20:08:00

For most people who are against this, I think it's mostly the thought that counts. They are of the opinion that the same privacy they have in physical life should be taken for granted on the internet. If it isn't, they throw a sissy fit.

I used to be a knee like you, then I took an adventurer in the arrow.

2020-05-08 21:32:39

The problem is that, well, this is the internet.  It's not your private home.  You're not locked behind closed doors anymore.  This is why I always tell people that when you hit send or submit or OK or anything that counts as acknowledgement of consent on any device or online platform, you can no longer take it back.  It will at the very least leave a footprint, at the very most, become a part of your life you may regret.
"Not behind closed doors, you say?  What is this?  My door is closed and even locked, for that matter!"  Yes yes yes, but when you go online you have established a connection to the outside.  Your walls and doors and windows and ceiling aren't holding it all back; you're dealing with other people from all around the world who all have differing opinions and agendas and aims and goals and so on!  Companies want to market as companies have always done.  So do those who are self-employed, for that matter!  That's how business works!  It's like gathering at a city square, only the square is divided into sections and subsections and even smaller branches, from small groups to larger communities, all united in a global colabaration that makes up the internet of things.
And yes, your information is a part of that global colaboration, no matter how much you don't want it to be, unless you just, disconnect and pull the plugs and go away!  There are tradeoffs for any aspect of life.  You can live out in the middle of nowhere, no phone, no PC, no smart devices, no communication and all the privacy you could ever want, or you can connect, and even if its just the one device it will eventually share at least one piece of information you probably don't want it to, be it your location or your Apple music play history, or more personal matters.

When life gives you oranges, demand lemons since everyone else is obviously getting them.

2020-05-08 22:05:57 (edited by NevEd 2020-05-08 22:09:50)

Just because google and amazon collect data doesn't mean that everything's ok and data can't be used with malicious intent. I really don't have a problem with personalized search results and ads on google and youtube, facebook showing me shit it thinks I'm interested in (minus the alt-rite religious trash), but people don't know or seem to care that companies gather even more than that. When I move into my own place, all my internet traffic is going to be filtered through a VPN. Why? More privacy protection, for one. My actual IP address will not show up for those who may want to find it for some reason. This also avoids the issue of DDOSing and swatting. Which is important if you become a content creator who is interactive with their audience.
Speaking of Facebook however, they're a company that takes it a step to far in my book, as they actually track private messages, and sell your private messages. I don't think anyone has to be ok with that at all.
Who cares? Me. I fuckin do, man. The idea of personal space, boundaries, etc, is not like they used to be. Call me old school but I don't give a single solitary shit about the financial interest of corporations when they screw people over. Don't even get me started on the medical industry pushing poison onto people and arresting people for posession of marijuana, when alcohol related mishaps happen everyday, and genetically modified, poisoned tobacco products are still on the market.. But that's another topic.

2020-05-08 22:48:52

Wow, yeah, a completely different topic indeed.  smile
I think the most private FB message I've sent would be an I love you.  If you've gone far beyond that?  Well, I seriously don't know what to tell ya.  I'd just like to point out though that if you're messaging your local drug dealer on FB you're probably either looking to get caught or seriously shouldn't be using the net.
If what @42 says is true though and FB is browsing through people's PM's, I dare say things are not as they used to be.  I'm sure AOL and MSN messaging never felt nearly as bad as all that.  Then again, what do I know.  I didn't study to become an online snoop.

When life gives you oranges, demand lemons since everyone else is obviously getting them.

2020-05-08 22:55:19

Lol unfortunately theirs not a communication channel they don't have a finger in. Discord IMO is a bit safer than FB. Luckily for us they're not gonna throw someone in jail because "weed" came up in their messages. But if it's harder stuff and they can charge you with conspiracy, they'll definitely do that. But to be real, if they locked up everyone who talked about drugs on the internet, people that would really need to be locked up would be out on the street.. Locking people up who use drugs isn't really helping them or anyone else when you look at it from a systematic perspective. I'm from the U.S., anyone know about the "war on drugs?"