Hey dan! I pinged you.

LOL I think you posted in the wrong topic targor.

Guess I'm not alone in that regard, turtlepower17. I have some of those masculine traits you described, but I've got feminine traits as well. Case in point, I get insanely emotional at times. I'm not sure if this can be considered feminine, but I also have the tendency to worry about others around me a lot, to the point where I'm completely zapped of energy myself until I know the other person is OK. I wouldn't want to transition myself though, because I still feel like a man despite having some of these traits. Besides, the concept of transitioning is kind of scary to me.
The problem with society nowadays is that people are more than willing to try and define what is and isn't appropriate for a given gender, ethnicity, social group, etc. I wish people would realize that it's not cool to judge others based on their principles, but I guess if people did realize that we'd have a perfect world.

Oh also...

Moderation:
Don't worry. This isn't a punishment announcement or anything.
I just want to point out a few things.
First of all, it's not a great idea to repost something that got you banned. It won't get you re-banned on its own, but chances are good that if it was wrong the first time, it's still wrong now.
Second of all, this is not the thread to discuss the past misdeeds of other people. If you really are concerned about someone's actions, you can feel free to reach out privately or start a different thread. Please endeavour to be civil. Wild accusations and attacks will get you absolutely nowhere.
Third, unless you do something so obviously awful that you're an immediate threat to the community, a ban is an indication of long-standing or repeated trouble. If you defend yourself from a ban with "this post really wasn't all that bad", the reason you got banned is because you had several other instances that were questionable and resulted in discipline. Please don't mischaracterize the situation.

Now, if you please, let's try and stick roughly to the topic at hand from here on in. I'd like to avoid further derailment of the sort that happened a dozen or so posts back.

That's the thing though, Jayde. Professionals have said that making huge changes like that is not good for the body. My father works as a nurse, and that's what I heard from him. That's why the idea of transitioning scares me so much. Sure, if you're a male and you want to transition into a female you can get hormone surgery, but technically you're body is still male at the DNA level because you still have 2 X chromosomes. This is why I said I wish we had better technology to change the DNA in one's body to actually change their gender. Unfortunately though, we're not quite there yet. I don't think we'll be getting technology like that for another 50 years at the least. I'm sorry if this post offends anyone BTW, that's not my intention. My intention is to point out the current flaws we have with medical technology today.

Moderation:
Jonikster, post 94 is pretty freaking transphobic. You can go ahead and consider this an official warning.

I'm going to dissect the hell out of this post. For those of you who were upset by it in the first place, I apologize in advance.

Jonikster wrote:
"I don't mind LGBT. This is the choice of every person. But, but I'm against transgender people!"

First of all, the T in LGBT actually stands for transgender, depending on who you ask. Saying you don't like them is pretty straight to the point. I mean, I guess you're entitled to your opinion, but it gets way worse.

Jonikster wrote:
"Why?
I'm not a doctor, I'm not a psychiatrist. I cannot assess whether it is a disease or not. But I'm blind and I'm heterosexual. I like girls.
If you want to be a transgender, please! This is your right. But there are two things:
1) I'm blind. And I can heal a transgender from a non-transgender. Don't believe? Let's meet and I will say whether you are a transgender or not! Your hands and your body will tell me the truth."

This isn't so much transphobic as really kind of creepy. This is the same guy who posted that recording of an anonymous woman's voice, right? I'll tell you something: I've had a trans woman speak to me, and I had no idea she was trans; ditto a trans man. Usually I can tell, but very occasionally I can't. But the thing is...that doesn't matter a damn. Whether or not I can tell makes no difference. They're trans. End of story. You're making it sound as if your ability to discern a trans individual by voice or touch is some awful thing. It's just not.

Jonikster wrote:
2) The second point comes from the first. I don't want to have a serious relationship with a transgender. I will be disgusted. And I don't want such people to surround me! When I find out that I like transgender, it will hurt a lot."

Okay, so you don't want to date a transgender person. Perhaps some aspect of someone's feeling or sounding male would put you off. I can't fault you for this, in and of itself. Don't date transgender folks if you don't want to. I'm sure there are loads of people who won't date you because of your ethnicity, your gender, your disabilities. People are free to choose who they date, and they're largely unable to influence who they're attracted to.
But saying you're "disgusted"? Uh...two or three steps over the line. Saying you don't want to date them is fine. Saying they disgust you is transphobic. And you "don't want them to surround you". They're not a freaking school of jellyfish. They're individuals. Odds are that you won't find groups of them in the same place unless you go looking. My advice: if you encounter a trans female here and there, deal with them as they arrive. Don't insult them. Just go on your way if and when you find out. Be courteous. If you don't want someone to insult you or snub you due to a choice you make, or even due to something outside of your control, then you owe it to others to show them the same respect.

Jonikster wrote:
"I can’t be tolerant in everything, especially regarding transgender people. For this reason, it will be difficult for me to live in Western countries...
I don't want to impose my opinion. I'm open to discussion, but I'm against controversy."

Oh boy. This is full of contradictions.
You start by doubling down and saying you can't be tolerant of trans people. That's just ridiculous; ninety-nine percent of them want nothing to do with you, statistically speaking, and for the other one percent, deflect them gently if you're not into that and move on. There's no need to speak of tolerance. You talk as if you have a right to this bigotry, but you really don't.
Next, you say you don't want to impose your opinion. Uh, bro? What did you just finish doing?
Last but not least, you're open to discussion but you're against controversy. If I understand you correctly here, what you're trying to say is that you're not willing to argue, but you want your own controversial opinion to stand. News flash: life doesn't work that way. I am throttling a pretty strong burst of rage as I write this, so I'm going to just say this much and move on. If you expected this to stand unchallenged, you've got another thing coming. Your opinion is controversial, and we weren't just going to let it stand. I was out for six hours or so, but when I got home, I saw four or five reports about this post alone. That should tell you just how popular your opinion is.

Jonikster wrote:
"Girls! Real girls! Please remember that you have the best hands, the best hair, the best voices. And transgender people will be not better than you!"

And now the putrefied cherry on top of an already rotten cake. Trans women are apparently not real women? Holy god, I have not had to work this hard at avoiding personal attacks in all my time on staff. I am thoroughly disgusted and beyond further words at this point.

Thus, I am going to discuss this on list, because this is by far not your first courting of controversy, and I'm not sure if we really need an influence like this poisoning the community any further. For anyone identifying as female, or for just anyone who saw this post and got upset, I once again want to apologize both for it existing at all, and for covering it this way.

Please take note: we have a zero tolerance policy on harassment and bigotry and the like. This counts as the latter, for sure, and might count as the former, depending on who's reading it.
You're free to be attracted to whosoever you please. Your standards are your own. But for heaven's sake don't turn them into this level of stupidity. If you want to be a bigot, a racist or something else similar, go do it someplace else and save this community the trouble of dealing with it. Please and thank you.

I didn't know there was such a thing as social dysphoria. I generally don't like labelling things, since I feel that there's enough trying to put people into neat packages going around, and I don't think every little quirk of humanity needs to be classified as though it's a new genum that's been recently discovered, but I'm at least willing to give it a quick Google and see if I can find some intelligent discourse on the matter. For the most part, the only label I want ascribed to me is me. I may be a host of negative things, abnormal ranking high among them, and those are labels in and of themselves, but any further clinical analysis, for lack of a better term, personally makes me uncomfortable. Many people can and do draw comfort from finding their community, but I guess, for me, there's never been any community to find. I've never been much of a fan of herd mentality, and, unfortunately, that's what many organizations eschew. For example, I've never been a churchgoer, not since I had any say in the matter, and the idea of joining the NFB makes my skin crawl. I have issues with both Christian ideals and NFB philosophy, though that's not remotely where I'm going with this. Like, the organization could literally have the most mild-mannered agenda as possible, and the people could be farting glowing rainbows, but I just can't do the groupthink thing. I can't agree with everything someone says just because they're leading the pack.

You know a comment is going to be good when it starts off with:

  I didn't read this topic completely. But I'd like to say.

  Also the fact he states he doesn't mind LGBT people, but is totally against trans-gendered individuals. What did he think the T stood for in LGBT?

  And my god, that comment was just full of cringe. I haven't seen someone fit intolerance, witchcraft, and a really creepy come-on onto women all in one post. My mind has been shattered.

Also, sorry for the temporary OT guys, but I responded to your PM Jaidon.

Moderation:
This is a quick update to let you know since Jonikster was on watch, this warning has resulted in a ban. Now. Back to your regularly scheduled discourse.

this is probably a strange point, but I was born with a condition called Crouzon syndrome that affected the way my face grew and caused my sight loss. for years I had to put up with the insults I got for the way I look and the way my voice sounds. I was offered surgery to make me look"normal". or, I guess the way I wanted to look. after years of thinking about it, I decided not to do it.
that's not to say it was the rite decision for some people, but I am me and I kind of don't understand why anybody would want surgery to be something they kind of aren't.
I hope this is making some kind of sence. I can understand that people can feel like they are a male trapped in a female body or a female trapped in a male body. but why not embrace what and who you are rather than having things removed or put on. you will still be the same person at the end of it.

as I mentioned in a previous post, a friend of mine had the surgery and she has regreted it ever since.

I am not trying to denigrate or cause trouble here but I ask in a total spirat of enquiry and to try to understand.

I hope that makes sence and I hope it doesn't offend anybody.

The difference is, you were offerred surgery to be more like other people thought you'd want to be. With gender dysphoria, it's the exact opposite: make the changes to be more like the dysphoric person wants to be, rather than what others think they should want.
This reminded me of something comparably minor that happened to me once. In my first semester of college, there were these decorative knee-high brick walls all over the place, at corners on the sidewalks in high traffic areas, etc. So I hit one just so as to fall over it right at the right angle to break a tooth. When talking to whichever parent was there after finishing installing the replacement, the dentist said that he'd made it a little wider than the tooth had been, to reduce the gap between my front teeth, because he just assumed that's what I would have wanted if I could see (he said this outright, like he didn't think I could hear him). And of course it was horribly unpleasant and I would have declined if someone had bothered to ask.
As unpleasant physical changes go, this was relatively minor, and not related to any of the other stuff I brought up in previous posts. But involuntary cosmetic alterations are involuntary.
At some point, my opinion was "x is part of nature, and therefore should be accepted." Then x y and z actually happened, I did research, and realized that no, actually, things being part of nature is completely independent from whether or not the thing ought to be acceptable. Smallpox, Polio, Malaria, HIV, Cancer, drought, famine, terrible storms, giant rocks that fall from the sky, deadly earthquakes and volcanos and tsunamis and floods, and mass extinctions are all part of nature. That doesn't mean we ought to simply accept them, and embrace the misery and loss that they bring. It means we build irrigation systems, levies, dikes, earthquake-resistent architecture, air filters, longer and longer-term food storage, medicine, vaccines, elaborate systems of infrastructure and communication solely dedicated to predicting and tracking storms and asteroids, sanctuaries for endangered species, etc, etc. It isn't hubris to fight against bad things, in and of itself. There are hubristic ways to go about it, but if you never fight, you'll never escape. And if you disagree with someone about how bad a thing is—or if it even is bad in the first place—then that's fine. No one is saying that everyone has to fight everything that someone somewhere found bad. But if a problem is solvable, and one never tries to solve it, then that's a lot of potentially avoidable suffering allowed to continue.
... But one person's problem is another person's Tuesday, or maybe even Saturday. Conversely, one person's pleasant-or-neutral experience can be another's Hell, or mild-but-persistent discomfort, or anything in between. I'm pretty confident that an extra millimeter or two between my front teeth would have had absolutely no negative effects, whereas closing the gap (without asking, I must repeat) added negativity for no gain whatsoever. Maybe someone else would have been really stressed out by a millimeter between their teeth, and been happier to find it closed. Maybe some people desperately want to look "normal", while others are happy the way they are. And the very same extends all over the spectrum of severity.

Oh, um, I really just meant to respond to SirBadger with the first paragraph. This was not meant as a rant directed at anyone in particular. And it went back and forth between addressing Typical Mind Fallacy and the Naturalist Fallacy, and I feel pretentious for using terms that end in the word "Fallacy".