2021-02-14 19:11:08

Lol you're telling me to grow up when you're the mole hiding in their hole only to pop up, start shit, then hide yourself away again.

Facts with Tom MacDonald, Adam Calhoun, and Dax
End racism
End division
Become united

2021-02-14 19:19:33 (edited by Rich_Beardsley 2021-02-14 19:20:23)

@126, Did it ever occur to you that people have lives outside of this forum?

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2021-02-14 19:36:34

The thing that gets me about this thread is that, in the process of calling blind people out for various behaviors, it engages in some of those very same behaviors. And then goes on to say "this isn't an everyone problem, it's you blindies!"

I mean, point made I suppose? I run with activists, various communities of marginalized folks, etc. And there are members of all of those communities that go forth and give the rest of us a bad name. But only in blindness-related communities do I see so much emphasis placed on how we all need to behave like representatives of blindness at every moment. And usually it's done in a very trainwrecky way. So maybe it *is* blindness-specific.

2021-02-14 19:48:48

Who knows?
What I will say is this. I do agree with some of the points, but what I don't like is the approach used to make them. This situation could've been handled differently

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2021-02-14 19:51:19

Also, putting this in a second post because I think it's important enough to address separately:

Perhaps sighted people are so lazy that if I, 40-year-old blind professional developer signed up to play their game, they couldn't tell the difference between 17-year-old blind punk who shows up and publicly jerks off. You know what? That's on the sighted person, not on me. I'm not to be held to a higher standard because I'm blind. A woman isn't to be held to a higher standard because she's a woman. Neither is someone who is black, LGBTQIA, etc. If lazy people making broad generalizations is genuinely a thing that happens, those of you coming at the marginalized group are a) directing your energy at the wrong place and b) harming more than you help. Wanna make positive change? Be a good person. Don't piss yourself off at people who will never change, or kiss the asses of lazy people who aren't even smart enough to know that every blind person/woman/person of color/child/adult/Texan/Californian isn't the same person because of whatever trait they've chosen to fixate on that day. And don't tell those of us spending our lives trying to be good people simply because being good is good in and of itself, that we also have to shoulder this additional burden of blind ambassadorship. Because I ain't trying any harder or doing anything differently just so some of you fools are better represented. tongue I'm not a blind representative, and no tantrum on a forum will change my mind on that.

In short, be a good person. I've *never* knowingly had anyone treat me differently because of blindness, or come back later and say "I didn't want to associate you because I hung out with this one dude 5 years ago and..." And, if that has happened and I don't know about it, oh well. Not like I'm having a hard time finding cool people, and that probably comes from trying to be a level-headed person who doesn't fly off the handle and push away folks who aren't down with that way of relating to the world.

OK, done for a while. Currently working on advocating for making an upcoming showcase game blind accessible. What are *you* doing today?

2021-02-14 20:05:59

Agree with @131

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2021-02-14 22:29:55

126, are you seriously accusing *me* of being the one who pops up and starts shit on a whim? Ahahahahahaha good one, I approve.
Also, as much as I hate playing the age card, I do find it rather amusing that you, a 30 something year old man, are spending your time herling around insults I might expect from a 14 / 15 year old. I say might expect, because seriously I know plenty of people that age, all of them on this forum, who are far more mature / together in the head than you've demonstrated yourself to be.

2021-02-14 22:59:51

great. We have resorted to personal attacks and character assassination to solve our problems. Ok children, don't make the big scary guys come in here and give you punishments.

2021-02-14 23:13:30

I don't know what you're reading, but that hasn't happened.

Facts with Tom MacDonald, Adam Calhoun, and Dax
End racism
End division
Become united

2021-02-14 23:33:14

Nope, definitely hasn't. Hell by our standards, I'd say we're being pretty civil.

2021-02-14 23:42:16

at least you both agree on something, that's a start. Maybe I said that lie on purpose to make y'all agree... I'm not as dumb as
ok yes I am. But I am smart too.

2021-02-14 23:48:31 (edited by musicalman 2021-02-14 23:52:36)

*sigh* Here we go again, debates turn into arguments where people just can't seem to agree or understand each other's side. To be fair, I don't think there's much to understand... Sure we'd love it if immature blind people could act respectable and stop soiling the reputations of respectable blind people, but it ain't gonna happen and we all know it. So what purpose does this topic serve?

All I see is it giving @GrannyCheeseWheel an opportunity to rant. Fair enough, I suppose. But I at least feel that's quite a self indulgent thing. By ranting like this, all you're doing is pretty much giving those who agree with you a chance to thumb you up and add to the fire, and forcing those who disagree with you to either argue your point or just step away. Not a very healthy discussion dynamic you encourage there... And yeah I know some people don't care about encouraging  healthy discussion dynamic and blah blah, they just want a place where they can vent. Fair enough I suppose, but don't expect forum members to stand by and let you do it. Public self indulgent behavior has consequences, and those consequences affect other people and snowball and can do all sorts of things.

GrannyCheeseWheel wrote:

If you're running into something you believe is a blindness specific accessibility barrier, then by all means, talk about it. But make a god damn effort will you?

Throwing the same back at ya, bud. If you actually think you're running into blindness specific issues with the way people act, make an effort to deal with it in a way that is actually, ya know, constructive. Don't stand on frustrated street ranting and raving about how the people you hang out with are shitbags, and don't drag us into the mess you have lost interest in cleaning up.

Look, you made good points. There are certainly situations where bad behavior from blind people has tainted our reputation as a community. I'm sure there are at least a few people I will meet who will think you and I are as bad as those 13-year-old blind kids who don't have any social skills and engage in so-called blinky behavior. So I get your frustration, but I think it is 1, overstated and 2, expressed in a way that isn't doing any good. And to be honest, plenty of sighted kids have issues like that, not expressed the same way but yeah.

You know autism has similar issues right? There are very respectable people with high functioning autism (I'm at least considering the fact that I am one of them), but when most people hear autistic, they immediately think stuff like, dependent, stupid, obsessive and inarticulate. To be fair Aspergers is closer to the high-functioning end of that scale, but still, it's lumped in with autism so carries some of that stigma with it. There are countless informal blogs by high-functioning autistics who try to get rid of these stereotypes, and none I have read resort to the op's tone. I mean, there are probably many which do, but all that's doing is making the outsider think autistics are a bunch of angry people who find it impossible to relate to normal folks. And if blind people do have a higher prevalence of autism, then you've got yourself a real issue, and calling groups of people with those issues fucktards and blinks isn't going to do anything good for them, no sir.

So yeah as others have said, your delivery has shot you in the foot. You can make excuses, you can do what I think you're going to do and say I shouldn't have to taint what I say for a bunch of sensitive *insert insult here*. But truthfully, the delivery does matter. If you actually intend to do some good, you'd better find a way to control the negative emotions, because the way you're expressing them now is toxic and doesn't actually help solve the problems you're so fed up with; it just creates more petty generic problems.

I know you can write better and think more deeply than this, based on some of your other posts here. To be frank, there are times when I almost wonder if your account has been hacked, because some of the time, you write extremely eloquently. Then sooner or later, something sets you off and you shift into this teenage emo "I hate the world and am going to have a one-man protest against this and that, and nothing you say will stop me" attitude, and it just saddens me to see. You've admitted in the past that you enjoy stirring shit up to see what happens, and while you're not doing that so much anymore, I still see this tendency you have to just let off steam without caring what anyone else thinks.

Back when I made this thread, I was frustrated. I could have written a hate speech about how I hate my blindness, how I hate accessibility barriers, how nobody gives a fuck about my real problems, or if they do, they're not doing anything to make it go away. I mean, I did express some of that in a diplomatic way I think, but still. I do have those thoughts from time to time. I don't express them outwardly, but I do have intense feelings of hatred of my blindness, and yes, I have a lot of disgust toward this community about the very things the op is railing against. However, my interest in being sensitive an understanding, is also very strong. So before I write anything down, I try to calm myself down to a reasonable amount. I was still mad when I wrote my thread, but I had at least gotten over the intense frustration bit, and I think, anyway, that that is why the thread didn't turn into a drama fest. The delivery helped set a better tone.

Unless this thread gets back on track soon, I think it should be closed. Xarvox's discussion was probably the best this thread could've seen, and we're well past that I think.
Edit: fixed typos, clarified autism point.

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