2020-01-26 23:31:23

Meh to other games, you should continue bloodbath. My honest opinion.

Thumbs up

2020-01-27 14:22:22

finish what ever o-you started before you started, else it'll get fucked up badly unless you have a new original idea in your mind

2020-01-27 18:30:05

@450, unless you can come up with something original, do not make a new game if you are planning to release it. I would say that multiple people told you this would eventually happen, but I am sure you already know that.
Myself, I am extremely neutral at this point. I will not pay or donate to this because there is nothing encouraging me to do so. I am sorry.

Thumbs up

2020-01-27 19:28:50

You had to have known he'd let go. He does it every time, with all the game projects.
I just hope you can get some help and keep this fps alive. Some people are too unstable to lean on... the circle is complete, things repeat themselves over and over and over again...
Seriously, I wish you good luck and a good future for your fps.

I usualy speak french, so please excuse all my english mistakes. Thanks!

2020-01-27 21:57:22 (edited by ivan_soto 2020-01-27 21:58:40)

So it goes on I see. Let me just let all of you know that I left the project because I will not develop and work all day for a community who complains endlessly.
I won't complain about it, so I left the project knowing that if I were to bring up points, most of the forum would sit here and go on and on and on about how we don't deserve this, or that.
Aside from TK, when have I left or pulled back any of my projects? Please give examples other than TK as the code to that was leaked anyway.
I'm ready and listening.
As far as I know, I have never discontinued any games on my website. If they go silent for a few months, you automaticly asume they're discontinued

Ivan M. Soto.
Feel free to check out my work and services.
http://ims-productions.com

2020-01-27 23:39:15

I am so sorry, but is this the first time you are developing games for this community? It's not, so you know very well how it is. If you didn't like it, why even start? Here, I'll give you another example, SBP. You will tell me that the code was so messy, and you are probably 100 percent right, but guess what? You could have had a look at the code and said nah, I am not even starting to work on this, the code is very messy. Always blaming others, blaming the community, player base, everyone is wrong. Tell me, what did the community do in this case that was so bad and made you leave? Was the project hacked? Was the code stolen? No, but how dare they expect a stable game and give feedback when the game isn't stable. Besides, noone told you you have to work all day on it. If you weren't ready, it's fine to say you know what guys? We're taking a break for a few months and will come with a stable update once it's ready. Yes, I am not saying that people would not complain in this case. I myself would not, but you must understand that there are people of all ages here, some of which only want to play and don't care how development works. If you are tired of the community though, take that break and go away for a while, work on the code when you feel like doing it. Once that time passes, make sure the update is ready and release it. Nothing can be 100 percent stable, but the less smooth a software is the more complaints you are getting.

Thumbs up 0

2020-01-28 18:41:10

I agree with 456 here. You chose to help. You chose to get involved. You signed up to develop this project. It is your fault. Stop shifting the blame to the community and own up to it. You won't develop anymore games for us? Why did you offer to help then? If we are so terrible and do nothing but complain, why did you offer your services to this project?
A project does not have to be discontinued in order to be flagged as such. BM, for example, costed people $5 and was suddenly made free. I believe that is called discontinuation? SBP was abandoned, pure and simple. Perilous Marathon, though not abandoned, partially experienced the same treatment as BM in regards to those who paid for the Mac version. Just because you did not discontinue projects does not mean you failed to provide sufficient customer services.
Point is, it is not the fault of the community and that you are responsible for your own actions.

Thumbs up 0

2020-01-28 21:12:44

at ivan:
the things that open sourced by you, or was in your hand and open sourced:
btb, clone of ultrapower that as history says you did your best for it to be in this comunity, and cm made on it and know one said hay why btb or cm made from it?
Balloon master, publicly you sayd discontinude in a day
old redspot v0.503: I don't care why you had that but
should I say more or its inuff for you to showing your history tk developer

Thumbs up

2020-01-28 21:48:07

At post 557,
Balloon master has received updates after the game going free.
Perilous Marathon costs money to develop for Mac, and as someone who does nothave a job, I'm not ready to spend $100 yearly to support audiogames that contribute very little income.
Aside from that, I need a Mac computer to compile the .app files, and currently that machine is broken and need to take it to the apple store which is about an hour away from me.
SBP wasn't my project, and the main developer wanted to move on to bigger and better things. I can't say I blame them either.

Ivan M. Soto.
Feel free to check out my work and services.
http://ims-productions.com

2020-01-29 00:35:06

Ivan is correct. And guys, the issues with BM / PM aren't exactly relevant here. For the record, and Ivan feel free to correct me on this, but as far as I'm aware Ivan had no plans to kill SBP outright and still had plans to eventually do things with it, I was the one who pulled the plug because it got to a point where I just didn't see a point anymore given the pending release of bloodbath, and I also felt kind of bad because I pretty much barely contributed to the re write say for a few updates after it went live. Again, you don't know what went on behind closed doors, you don't know our motives. Stop assuming we're out to rip you off with every tiny mistake we make. Again, all of the games in question could have probably been handled better, and to an extent we're both guilty of rushing things, not always testing things as much as they aught to be tested and in Ivan's case not always being able to respond to key requests in a timely manner, but seriously? Again, with paid products I think it's fair to say you're owed a certain level of support that hasn't always been met with Ivan's games, but even so the BS I've seen from this forum as a hole because of this is fucking ridiculous not to mention highly rood / ungrateful. At the end of the day, we take time out of our lives, time we could be spending on our education or on partaking in more leisure based activities, to instead make games for a very tiny market, often for little or no reward even if the product is paid. We do it not because we feel some obligation to do it, but because we enjoy coding and want to see others enjoy our work. In the case of free games, like this one, we owe you absolutely nothing. Zilch. If one of us has to travel all the way to Scotland for half a week to see a loved one and then again to dorset to see an old friend (I did both of these things shortly after the game's release), or when one of us has to go on holiday to minnesota for a week for some breathing room and to spend some quality time with friends in the area (Ivan), you guys have 0 right to complain when you're updates aren't delivered as fast as you might like or the game lags behind because we have better things to do than eradicate every single problem or fix every little bug you guys find. Again, we don't owe you anything. Show some dam respect. Ivan has done a hell of a lot both for this game and for SBP, at least for the re write. What exactly gives you guys the right to question his morality, to outright call him lazy when half of you couldn't even code worth shit yourselves, or even to question his motives, insinuating that he's out to steel your money and a lot of other things based purely off of uneducated opinions and snap judgements based off of actions he committed in the past that stopped being relevant years ago?
Honestly, if it weren't for the genuinely nice and insightful discussions that pop up here from time to time I'd have left this shit hole years ago. I originally got into game development because I thought I could make a difference and possibly make a name for myself here in the process. To an extent I still feel some of that passion I felt as a 13 / 14 year old, but I've lost so much of my motivation for coding over the years. Sometimes I get the idea to maybe do something with BB or whatever, maybe finally polish up and release huntation etc, but once that mood goes away I find myself drifting away to other things and just not wanting to code. Don't get me wrong, I still do love coding, but most of the time I'm just not in the right frame of mind to get anything done. There were times, like when I was working on SBP, where I could code for hours and hours on end working on something or trying to figure out why something didn't work as expected, and when I was finished I'd have this huge sense of accomplishment, like I'd really done something right. Seeing games like minefield, huntation, bloodbath etc grow from tiny betas into fairly decent little games was a truly unique experience, I still look at games like  huntation I coded entirely from scratch with no help from others and think woe, shit, I made this thing? I'd love to have that feeling again, to have the motivation to do something good with this or to create something else equally worth while, but so often I just can't, I'm not there mentally, things get left behind and forgotten. I've been getting these huge bouts of depression again, it feels almost as bad if not worse than it did in 2014 through 2016, if not more so because I'm less naive now and have a greater awareness of the world around me. Coming out has helped me in ways I can't describe, but I still get depression for reasons that aren't even related to my dysphoria. I wish I knew the answer to my problems and could bring the old me back, the me who took real pleasure in creating games for the community rather than want to hide or shoot herself at the mere thought of doing so, but the truth is I just don't. No, this is not a cry for sympathy or anything of the sort. I expect nothing from you guys, I recognise you guys owe me nothing the same way I owe you nothing. All I'm doing is letting you know the situation as we stand and asking that you show me and Ivan some respect and at least try to be somewhat constructive.

Thumbs up

2020-01-29 01:16:27

Yeah, make sure you tell us 50 more times that we actually can't code and then ask for respect? Nice try. Well, at least one person who posted here amerikranian knows how to code, and there are probably way more. But is that really relevant? I am not talking about his coding stile, he might be the best coder in the world, we are all talking about his attitude of constantly abandoning things and blaming others for that. Nothing to do with the fact we can or can't code a game. Also, I am really sorry for the way you feel. Personally, I didn't put all that much blame onto you, other than the fact you rushed the release, but that's a mistake people often make and isn't something that would make me instantly lose all the respect for you. Rather, all this stupidity you guys can't even code is really becoming annoying. At the end of the day, you are completely right, you don't owe us anything, but you released a game and you are making a name for yourself. Whether it will be positive or negative depends completely on your actions. You don't owe anyone to release an update in one week, and in fact I don't complain about the time all that much. If you look at my posts, I have clearly said you should just take a break for a while  and come back to coding this project once you feel you are ready. Time is not the issue here, rather the fact of oh well a few major issues came up so let's abandon the project and say everyone was so ungrateful. Well, no, that's not true. Why do you expect people to be like oh this game is great, except there's one little problem, we have huge lag, but the rest of it works fine. Ping time is such a huge factor in a realtime action multy player game. If I can't have good speed, I can't play. If 50 people can't play, they have the right to complain, in a similar way you have all the right to ignore them as this is as you have said a free game. But now, there's another part. You are asking for donations. As soon as you go into the field of asking for money, you have to realize that most people probably won't donate to a game they can't even properly play yet. So it's too early for that. I get it, server costs and all the other things you have to cover, which is why I said probably take the game down for a while and come back once everything is sorted out as best as you can.
Whatever you do though, good luck as this thing certanily has great potential to grow.

Thumbs up

2020-01-29 03:50:05

Here’s the problem: you ignore our feedback. I have told you on your topic multiple times that the game was not ready for release. What did you do? You still went ahead and published it, knowing  Full well of all the issues it had and/or could have.  You ask for respect, which we already give you, but he also throw our concerns aside  when it comes to the mechanics and or the server. You choose to bulldoze on, leaving a trail of bugs for us to follow. I do not expect a release to be perfect, that would be foolish and unreasonable. What I do expect, though, is using your available resources. If you knew that you were going to travel and would be unable to keep up with the feedback, why did you release your product at such  inopportune time?  If you knew that you would be forced to work on the code alone for a bit, why did you release the game at this point? If you knew of the community feelings, I was not the only one who said that the game was not ready, why did you release it anyways?  After all, you owe us nothing. You are not pressured to release anything. You could’ve said that you were abandoning this project and people won’t blink an eye because it is a common thing to get in over your head these days.  You could’ve said that you needed another four or so months for testing purposes, and while some will complain, most of the people will except your answer. So, you want our respect when you disregard our feedback, am I reading this correctly?  If so, I hate to tell you, but that’s not how life works.  Also, if you knew you were going to have server issues in regards to costs, why did you release the game at such a point in time?  A good chunk of this topic is people complaining that the server is largely unstable.  So, what do you owe us? Or rather, what do you feel like you owe us?  Feeling indebted is the only explanation here. You say that you are not bound by anything, and yet something forced you to release the game when it wasn’t ready.  You say that we are disrespectful and did you not appreciate your efforts, so why do you develop for us? What keeps you here? What forces you to show your hand before you have all the cards? If you can figure that out and prevent it from occurring again  you will game a valuable ability to understand, evaluate, and consider your project from the public side.

Thumbs up +1

2020-01-29 04:16:57

Just to clear a few things up, I didn't know Ivan would walk out when he did. That was completely unplanned. Again, I don't blame him for it in the slightest, just thought I'd clear that up before I continue.
I of course knew of my own busy schedule. The problem lay in the fact that we just didn't have any idea just how bad the lag would get. My original plan was to release it, use the few days I had at home to fix anything that might have needed fixing, then let the bug reports / ideas roll in while I was away. Of course, since the game was very much unplayable at time of launch Ivan ended up having to work overtime trying to fix it whilst keeping up with the demands of the players.
Feature wise, I think it was pretty much ready. The  problem lay pretty much entirely on the lag. Were it not for that, this would have probably turned out pretty much ok. The lag was what fucked us up from the beginning. We just didn't prepare enough. I think the blame lies mostly on me here, honestly. Truth be told, I was just very excited to get the thing out the door that I looked past some of the potential issues, although not completely for lack of testing though of course lakc of testers was also a problem.

Thumbs up

2020-01-29 04:26:55

I mean, I'd suggest taking the game down briefly to patch up sever issues and maybe adjust the map size downwards. Though, considering what happened when Redspot was taken down for a rewrite, I doubt the complaints will stop.

  I still think one should of aimed for feature heavy smaller map than a large empty one. I'll happily go up to the roof and hop down. 

  Or uh, making a single game mode to give players an objective for something different. Even if it's just only a simple team death match/free for all modes at the start.

The answer to your question is forum.audiogames.net/search

Thumbs up

2020-01-29 08:45:08

at559, hmm: intresting answer
I think bb devs, you should add multy server hosting, to let people host they servers if you don't want to work on it

Thumbs up

2020-01-29 09:58:27

Who said I wasn't working on it? I certainly didn't...
Oh, and no. That's not happening. Case and point, RTR / SBP / TK / UP.

Thumbs up

2020-01-29 12:45:55

right, this gunna be a long post, so hold on tight fokes. hope you have at least 5-10 minutes to spare to listen to the thoughts of this totally insignificant dude living in a seviourly populated part of the world posting on this humble place known as the audiogames forom where we like(or aim and try) to discuss, well? audiogames.
See, the thing is. coding isn't all that matters. and i'm not talking from a technological perspective. i mean, well let me rephraize. development isn't everything. it is just a faize;all be it a very big one. After the project is done and ready for release as per the developer, there is much to be done. There is the testing phaize; the bug fixing phaize. And no, i certainly am not referring to the fixing after-release. pre-release, you need a group of trusted poeple, who you know can have an openn mind, and give an unbiost feedback on the product you are offering and have the skills, patienc, tallent and hopefully experience to do so. In your case, that wasn't a small group of friends, which like i said isn't really easy to arrange especially with 1 or two people working alone, but the community at large, itself. which is one way to do it and that is totally fine.
However, like i said when it is one individual or just a few individuals, the pressure increases. especially if you are asking for feedback from a community at large. The world's full of good as well as bad people as i'm sure as you're aware, but its not split into as such and cannot be generalised. there are good people who might put their points across in a way that might offend/hurt the producer;others might just spew unconstructive bullshit just for kicks whilst some may not care about anything but the game itself. Its quite diverce, you see. It all depends on the mindset of hte dev himself, the key, in my case it to keep a level-head, stay calm, and try to take things in a good way. Yes, i understand that this cannot be the easiest job many times, but like i said it is necessary. Sure you have expectations from the community, such as they understanding your lack of resources (be it human or otherwise) and they having the decency to respect and understand that. But Like i said, the world isn't a bed of flowers; but certainly not one of thorns either. If you are entrusting them to get something done for you they should have the curtesy to try to at least put their points across in a half decent manner and respect the work that has gone into it. However, some might not. or some might, and it may not seem so. Like i said, its all about how you make yourself accept what you see. This, like i said is why a group of people turns out to be really handy in these cases. Its how big companies function. When its just you, and perhaps a cupple of your friends the similar mindsets/openians may be a hindrance. Sometimes you need a diverce group of people to be working alongside you, not just for the sake of ideas and the project itself; but also in these cases. To pull you up when everything seems lost. When you might be feeling hopeless, and and the other person might not, hope you get my point. But it is  understandable that you may not be fortunate enough to enjoy that kind of luxxery(me being there so i understand, still am sometimes), and like i said above you are right to have certain expectations from the community. but this is a community. There will be people who will not what you expect from them; or  be decent individuals at least. The key, like i said is to hae control on your mind and body. control your immotions. Sure you have to let the community influence you, but only in the ways that matter in the longrun. They give feedback, you have to accept that, no matter how harsh that is and try to take it in a possitive way and move on. Lotus grows in muddy water, doesn't it? Mushroom, (something that i love by the way) is a fungi. So dont worry, have faith on yourself try to be rational and practical and try to keep a level head. meditatoin helps a lot, at least in my experience.
@ivan
while your reasions of doing what you did are quite understandable and rational, i would love if you give this a thought (this plus my above post)
As i previously stated, producing something a project does not just mean developing it. As a co-dev you have responsibilities. And not the just the working hard part(which i've hurd you've been doing pritty well in yorur time as part of this project so hats off) but before you sign up. You have to think about the duties that you will be handed. responsibilities. The work and time to be devoted. It is basically a commitment that you are making. And whilst like i said its perfectly vallid to back out when you know youv'e had enough i just think you should give more thought to those kindof things next time you decide to help somebody with their project. Its not just you when you are in, you see. you are a group. And when you leave, a big amount of workload may be handed down to the other person/persons especially if the gorup is small. Although the work might not be anything they've not delt with before, it may seem a lot if they are used of a proper work division and being actaully comfortable with what and how much they contribute, time and effort wise.
Like  i said, keeping a level head is very important. This applies for taking big steps such as this, as well as releasing a project. you godda stay calm, keep a clear head, think then when you really think you are ready, go ahead and do it. dont just charge into the fire because of excitement/temperarry inspiration which may die down. Be like water. Flow constantly. Not fire. Which starts up, and dies out. I know i'm putting really big points and thoughts across and everybody would be thinking, haha this guy, trying to be a yogi and giving all  these preechings and whatnot. But trust me. these are facts of life and the sooner you come to terms to them the better. I myself took quite a while but i'm Happy that i did. So yeah, i know i've said this a lot, but its all about the mind. Critisisms will come. Think of  a youtuber, especially in the early days of his currior. How much critisism and hate comments they'd get, that's mainstream community, much much bigger than our humble little ag community, haha.
And think about my point on thinking before taking important steps/leeps in your life this way:
Imagine a guy, working tireless at work. After a long, long time, gets a bonus and holidays where he can spemd some time to himself, or with his friends/family on a holiday somewhere. He's all excited and happy and packing things. However, he's so happy and daydreeming about his plans so much that he forgets to pack half the things he'd want then when he gets there, it'd all be ruenned. There's a time and place afor everything. Like, i try to keep a level head and try to be strict with myself while packing in this case, then once i'm all done and e.g. in the car, then i dreem and talk about my plans and ideas with peeps like, all the way to the place lol.
Anywyas, that's all for this extremely long and boring post, hope somebody benefits from it.

Abay chal.

Thumbs up

2020-01-29 15:04:14

@Aarush, well said and I agree with all of your points. As previously stated, I had a lot going on last november / December and I just wasn't my self in so many ways, what with my dad having recently undergone chemotheripy and me basically being ghosted by someone who's support I really needed for reasons I'm still not entirely sure about. I'm slowly picking myself back up and you guys should see a lot more from me in the future not just regarding bloodbath but other games in the future. I'll be looking into getting a server once I get back from college in a few hours, then we can get this thing moving again.

Thumbs up

2020-01-29 15:14:08

I have to agree with HM here. Why is everyone insistent on multiple servers to divide up the player base? We're not Overwatch or COD, the number of people usually playing at a time can be counted via a combined effort of all one's fingers and toes. Also, we've had times with RTR were no one could really play anything as none of the servers worked. Going full multi-server would just result in a headache again, unless a solution can be found for a main server. And maybe when the population picks up, think of either multi-server support or another suggestion earlier stated, along one to make private lobbies with friends for private matches for practice.

The answer to your question is forum.audiogames.net/search

Thumbs up

2020-01-29 17:50:34

Or do it the COD MW2 way. Hosted lobbies. No servers involved, somebody connects to the online framework, they host, others connect. That person disconnects or lags out? Host transfer.

Warning: Grumpy post above
Also on Linux natively

Jace's EA PGA Tour guide for blind golfers

Thumbs up

2020-01-29 19:23:43

haily what about going far away from this comunity and forum?
well i just adviced for you, if you can not do coding, you have problems, education, etc, and you are tired from this people, what about staying far away some time? sorry if it was offensive.

Yours kindly

Thumbs up

2020-01-29 19:47:28

I'll admit, I've considered it. The problem is usually that I just find myself checking back every once in a while when I have nothing better to do. It's like, my go to place when I have nothing else going on or am just board or whatever. I'm not sure what I could really replace it with, and given my current issues I'm not sure I could really muster the willpower to stop myself visiting.

Thumbs up

2020-01-29 21:52:55 (edited by JoWier 2020-01-29 21:54:39)

tbh, i check it when i have nothing better to do too, that is to say, the drama/flamewar topics, others i usually look at, such as valueable quality content in new releases, some nice topics in OT, general games, dev room, etc. should start posting more frequently though, get lazy i guess. but with the ones where a lot of drama and personal attacks are involved i just, pass. like, its not really wirth it telling anything to this people at this point imo. like i said, i do read them once in a blue moon but posting according to me, isn't wirth it. no point telling those people anything, when clearly they have shown that things as harsh as ban(currently the strictest punishment offerred on this forom) will not stop them. heh
Uh, wait is strictest a word even? i dont think so...

Abay chal.

Thumbs up

2020-01-30 10:20:30 (edited by Dakonna 2020-01-30 10:28:06)

I wouldn't entirely discount the possibility of self-hosted servers down the road if the system isfleshed-out enough. Here's what you need.
-An easily distributable server application for your hosters, which they can simply set up and run if they have the technical knowledge to do it.
-The server application should be changeable between public and private servers. A public server would appear in a central list that everyone with the client could access, while a private server would require you to enter a host address and port like in crazy party. We know that such a model works, because back before cp got the central server, it all worked out beautyfully, in fact the cp group on skype was mainly used to advertise servers and organise matches. You could even set it up so that people can auto-check for new public servers, where the client would fetch the server list every minute or so until one is found and automatically connects you if it finds one.
-Once a public server goes online, it should appear in the list for anyone to connect to, if they aren't on a blacklist. However, should that server ever go down, it disappears instantly until it returns. This should happen automatically, so you don't have to constantly check on servers. Rtr's major problem was that it didn't do this. When someone was hosting a server, Talon had to add it to the list manually and push out a patch so everyone could see it, and once it went down it was still there, so people didn't know the server's status.
-There should be some way of communicating to the client what the server is doing before you connect to it. e.G. the number of players it currently has, the game mode (if they ever become a thing), etc.
I know all of this is basically possible in bgt. Crazy party does it all (even after the introduction of a central server). It's why it held up much better than rtr did, and I am sure, if rtr had done the dynamic list thing it would have stuck around for a lot longer as well.

I used to be a knee like you, then I took an adventurer in the arrow.

Thumbs up

2020-01-30 10:35:18

A dynamic server list would be possible, my main concern would be the already small playerbase. I can add it though if people really want it, but right now I think It'd just be unnecessary.
In other news, I now have a windows server on which I can host BB. I've got another full day of exams today but expect things to be running later today once I've had the chance to configure nvda / nvda remote and get all the shit installed that needs installing.

Thumbs up