2019-02-16 02:14:12 (edited by Dekyo-NEC2608 2019-02-16 19:49:03)

WTD is a MML sound driver for WonderSwan and WonderWitch. You can make music and sound effects, though I've not played with it at all, only I read a bit the manual and compiled the demo songs. The compiled data can be a .WTD file that is for WonderSwan, or a .FX file that is for WonderWitch.
.WTD files can be converted into a ROM image (.WSC) for play it in a WonderSwan emulator. Owever, if you change the WSC extension to WSR, you can play it with Audio Overload or any player that supports the format.

Yamaha YM2608

YOU
SAY! - Sonic the Hedgehog CD (Dec 4, 1992 prototype)

2019-02-16 04:21:40

thanks for the info. there should be a dedicated wonderswan tracker similar to famitracker or rmt

be a hero and stop Coppa now!
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1Dkm … DkWZ8/edit
-id software, 1995

2019-02-16 19:53:13 (edited by Dekyo-NEC2608 2019-02-16 19:53:44)

I never used any type of tracker in my life. I only know that trackers will give me a headache.

Yamaha YM2608

YOU
SAY! - Sonic the Hedgehog CD (Dec 4, 1992 prototype)

2019-02-17 01:05:09

I also like the ADSP series of chips. these chips were used in several Leland and midway arcade games. fun fact: one of those chips was also used in the dectalk synthesiser.

be a hero and stop Coppa now!
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1Dkm … DkWZ8/edit
-id software, 1995

2019-02-17 17:05:01

@26, Is the syntax similar to PPMCK's MML implementation?

Oh no! Somebody released the h key! Everybody run and hide!

2019-02-17 18:07:20

I like the sound of FM when it's done right but most people kinda get boring with it, and especially having FM alone is just meh. I like a PCM or something channel to be thrown in there. The soundtrack I'm currently liking is After Burner 2, track 9, After Burner, Melody Version, ripped from an emulated z80 on a 3DS. Which since YouTube isn't helping me today sounds like this. That's a YM2151 and a Sega PCM. If you're not a chip freak don't let that square wave fool you it's actually being made by the FM chip! YM2151, which seemed to be very popular in arcade games, only had FM, no PSG in it. You can tell the square is FM by listening to the way it decays, it's not just volume it's actually getting duller. Wavetable chips are cool too, and for the mml programmer they're easier to get a sound out of than FM. I can take this audacity plug-in and plop a wave file I've pre-cut and sampled into it and it spits out some numbers, which I can configure what chip they're for, and plop it into an mml file. FM ain't near that simple, and when using mml and not a tracker of some sort with live preview you spend forever just trying to get the sounds you want, and FM drums? I could never grasp how the hell you make those. The C64 was feckin' cool too in it's day, the amiga as well. The Amiga could have been so much more if people had just employed software mixing, it truly was a fully capable sound card which if you had the power you could mix a fuck ton of sounds on and avoid the resampler. But nobody did, maybe the CPU was bad enough that you couldn't do software mixing and run a demo/game at the same time. Some mods do use both channels with one sound to do panning and stuff but overall they use them all separately. And they are actually supposed to be hard left and hard right, they end up being halfwidth because the hard panning can be hard on the ears when listening through headphones. I think most people had speakers on the thing. Wish I could make a SID tune with mml, but the only compiler for it, XPMCK, has the shittiest c64 implementation it could ever have. I do like it's FM implementation though where you actually use mml to poke the registers, instead of either poking the registers directly, IWW! Or using the PMD style tone envelope definition, but I'm getting into something called mml2vgm so I have to get myself comfortable with the PMD format. I also have PMD, Dekyo might like/know that one, but I'm so used to ppmck syntax it's a bit of getting used to. Not as bad as mml2vgm though, there's something about apostrophes and envelopes are all weirdly defined using this extended ADSR shit and you don't have @v anymore, and I really need @v. I mean I guess since the majority of those chips are FM I don't have to use @V everywhere but for PSG's and wavetables it'd be nice as an alternate. Also documentation isn't in English and it's got this command chart that even the people who can see get head aches from the thing. Nasty. Wish it was an html table. Anyways I'm rambling about mml now but yeah those are the ones I like. I like the sound of FM chips, but programming them is a bitch. I can't even imagine raw register poking, surely even game composers didn't have to do that though because drivers. Basic PCM chips add a litle flavor to some FM sound, the combo can be good. Genesis had a great combo, had a blippy little PSG for sfx and some really retro sounds, though the noise generator sucked ass, an FM chip with not too many, not too few channels, and that little DAC for ya drums. Amazing to see some of the soundtracks made for that thing, and people to this day are still using actual! Genesis hardware to make music.

----------
An anomaly in the matrix. An error in existence. A being who cannot get inside the goddamn box! A.K.A. Me.

2019-02-17 22:36:45 (edited by Dekyo-NEC2608 2019-02-17 23:24:08)

Making FM instruments (especially for PMD, FMPv4 or FMP7) is easy, at least I'm learning little by little with YM2608 Tone Editor. I'm much more familiar with PMD than the FMP system, IIRC mml2vgm's syntax is based in FMP. As to wavetable, is even more easier with SF2WT. I remember doing a FM electric piano for the FDS, and that sounded really great! I love making FM things for wavetable. I've called pseudo-FM  to that kind of waveforms.
For @30, the syntax is different than ppmck. WTD includes an English manual but SW's English is not good.

Yamaha YM2608

YOU
SAY! - Sonic the Hedgehog CD (Dec 4, 1992 prototype)

2019-02-17 22:57:14

I also like the miki chip used in the atari lynx, and the jerry chip used on the Jaguar. the former is quite similar to pokey, while the ladder is closer to Paula from the amiga.

be a hero and stop Coppa now!
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1Dkm … DkWZ8/edit
-id software, 1995

2019-02-18 15:53:13 (edited by pulseman45 2019-02-18 16:08:10)

@24: My sincerest apologies for not spelling the YM2608 right, moreover I did verify how it was written before writing it here so I have no clue how I still made that mistake in the first place.
@31: I also prefer having something else to complement FM chips, be it PSG, PCM or both.

2019-02-18 19:19:12

I also like the beeper chip used on the zx spectrum 48k.

be a hero and stop Coppa now!
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1Dkm … DkWZ8/edit
-id software, 1995

2019-02-18 21:36:02

You have listed chips that I never have heard of. I'm interested in weird sound beasts.

Yamaha YM2608

YOU
SAY! - Sonic the Hedgehog CD (Dec 4, 1992 prototype)

2019-02-18 23:11:30

@americandaad2005
The Beeper chip is certainly an interesting little beast, and people have made some rather interesting tunes with it.
Another favorite is the D1867G, which was the soul sound hardware behind one of the most famous toy keyboards of the 80s, the CASIO VL-1, or VL-Tone depending on where you live. The instrument sounds themselves were mainly just filtered pulse waves with different tones, and you could also program your own instruments by using the keyboard's built-in calculator function. It could also generate noise, though that was only ever used for the famous rhythm sounds themselves.
This next one is in the PSG department, it's the DPC (Display Processor Chip), which was only ever used in one game, and this provided the Atari 2600 with improved visuals, and additional audio capabilities. It was used in Pitfall II: Lost Caverns to provide background music during gameplay. It could only generate square waves.
The SSMP (which probably stands for Sony Sound and Music Processor) was the main audio unit behind the SUper Nintendo and Super Famicom. With 2 chips, the SPC700 and the DSP chip, I've heard some amazing stuff with that chip alone, such as Donkey Kong Country and Final Fantasy VI. It also had a built-in delay function to go with it, which was put to great use, especially in the Final Fantasy games, and even in Chrono Trigger. It's also very accurately emulated in the 2.0 update of Plogue's chipcrusher. Not surprising since they always take pride in very accurately emulating sound chips and their small details.
Since we're on an FM craze here, I'd also like to mention that I do enjoy the sounds of the Yamaha sound chips such as the YM2151, the YM3812, the YM2413, and the YM2612. While this isn't a Yamaha chip, the VRC7, while technically a derivative of the YM2413, sounds pretty good too.

2019-02-19 03:23:35

I also like the chip that was used in the super cassette vision. it's basicly like a standalone version of the fds's expantion sound chip.

an updated version of the DPC, the BTP by supercat, was used in a couple of homebrew 2600 games. It's basicly a cut down version of the Paula chip from the amiga.

be a hero and stop Coppa now!
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1Dkm … DkWZ8/edit
-id software, 1995

2019-02-19 06:51:23 (edited by Dekyo-NEC2608 2019-02-19 07:02:12)

@ammericandad2005 Is there a demo somewhere? If you guys find a new wavetable (not sample-based) chip, I'm definitely interested.

Yamaha YM2608

YOU
SAY! - Sonic the Hedgehog CD (Dec 4, 1992 prototype)

2019-02-19 13:38:53

Since I mentioned toy keyboards a while ago, I'd like to draw your attention to one chip in particular, and it's a wavetable tone keyboard as well. I'm sure @Dekyo-NEC2608 will appreciate this one.
Unfortunately I cannot find info about this chip nor the keyboards it was used in, but I do remember how it sounded like, and I can also tell you that the sound hardware was used in many other toy keyboards, since I owned some when I was younger.
The first keyboard that I could find that used this was probably the My Music Center keyboard. It had a total of 8 instrument sounds (Piano, Organ, Mandolin, Guitar, Music Box, Bell, Trumpet, and Violin, none of which sounded very realistic of course, and those instruments were used in other toy keyboards that used this same sound hardware, and some variants had different, and sometimes new sounds that were added. It had 4 channels of sound plus sampled drums. As a player, you could only play 2 notes at a time, since essentially the other 2 channels are used to add a chorus effect, and all four channels were used for the demo songs.
As I mentioned the instruments themselves don't sound that realistic. Here are the ones I distinctly remember.
1. The Trumpet sounded more like a 12.5% pulse wave.
2. The Bell sounded more like a marimba, or maybe a vibraphone.
3. The Music Box was raised up an octave and is basically just a sine wave.
4. The Violin sort of sounded like a 50% square wave.
5. The Organ sounded more like a sawtooth waveform, though in another toy keyboard I had which had the same instrument presets, the organ on that one sounded more like a real organ.

I wish I knew a little bit more, but sadly I had to sell my keyboards off. A shame, because those keyboards produced some very interesting sounds, and sometimes I would mess around with it to see what kind of stuff it was capable of doing. Now I wish I had them back just so I could do some chip experiments or something.
Now you're probably wondering what the actual keyboard sounded like. Thankfully I was able to find the demo songs that came with some toy keyboards that used this chip, including the likes of Jingle Bells, Santa Claus is Coming to Town, Let it Be, and Spanish Coffee. Other toy keyboards had totally new demo tunes made for them.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k5WyTdeJOKM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mUULRF3jpY8
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mUULRF3jpY8
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jqGjMnyDWXc

2019-02-19 17:22:51

btp chip demo:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Eewsw9LWxqQ

be a hero and stop Coppa now!
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1Dkm … DkWZ8/edit
-id software, 1995

2019-02-19 18:42:18

@FamilyMario Actually, I know that My Music Center toy keyboard, but only by watching videos. You can read a review by Cyberyogi (I absolutely recommend check this websittttttttttttttte) here.

Yamaha YM2608

YOU
SAY! - Sonic the Hedgehog CD (Dec 4, 1992 prototype)

2019-02-19 19:16:23 (edited by Dekyo-NEC2608 2019-02-19 19:19:52)

I've listened to the Super Cassette Vision, and I liked it. NEC was in charge of the hardware of the SCV. When Epoch temporarily withdrew from the market, NEC, the one in charge of the hardware of SCV, released the PC-Engine to replace this machine. SCV's sound processor is the uPD1771C. It has one channel that can use square waves, noise but only in a single channel.

Yamaha YM2608

YOU
SAY! - Sonic the Hedgehog CD (Dec 4, 1992 prototype)

2019-02-20 01:17:56

they also made the chip on the Casio pv1000. It's a 3 channel psg very similar to the ay8910, though it doesn't support volume envelopes.

be a hero and stop Coppa now!
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1Dkm … DkWZ8/edit
-id software, 1995

2019-02-20 01:42:47 (edited by Dekyo-NEC2608 2019-02-20 01:43:52)

Yeah, and they manofactured the already mentioned "D1867G" used in the Casio VL-1.

Yamaha YM2608

YOU
SAY! - Sonic the Hedgehog CD (Dec 4, 1992 prototype)

2019-02-23 22:10:12

Here's an example of my favorite sound chip, the MOS Technology Sid chip.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4EcgruWlXnQ

#FreeTheCheese
"The most deadly poison of our times is indifference. And this happens, although the praise of God should know no limits. Let us strive, therefore, to praise Him to the greatest extent of our powers." - St. Maximilian Kolbe

2019-02-23 22:38:51

Update: the chip I called btp is actually dpc+. btp was the name of the sound engine used.

be a hero and stop Coppa now!
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1Dkm … DkWZ8/edit
-id software, 1995

2019-02-23 22:44:26

also, appearently epson made a sound hip as well. It was similar to the ay-3-8910 and was primarily used in childrens toys. TSAmaster has uploaded a youtube video of fisher price's Super star stacker toy which is one of the toys using this chip.
and while I'm talking about toys, V-tech used the ti ms5220 speech chip as a makeshift dac in some of their toys. Not only was it used for it's intended purpus of speech synthesis, but it was also used as a 1 channel wavetable heard for the music in the music related activities for example.

be a hero and stop Coppa now!
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1Dkm … DkWZ8/edit
-id software, 1995

2019-02-24 11:43:45 (edited by pulseman45 2019-02-24 11:50:03)

@FamilyMario: I have actually known two different toy keyboards with those exact demo songs. If I remember well, the order would be "Jingle Bells", "Santa Claus is coming to town", "Spanish Coffee" and finally "Let It Be". One of the keyboards had a behaviour that I wouldn't be able to explain, if you would push the volume to a certain level, the pitch would go up. I really wonder why it would happen.
Edit: I remember there was also Vivaldi's Spring as a demo song between "Spanish Coffee" and "Let It Be".

2019-02-28 20:08:34

Are all of these sound chips integrated circuits you can solder onto a circuit board for use with auditory circuit experimentation?

Ulysses, KJ7ERC
She/they
Reedsy