2011-05-17 23:27:13

Hello.
Ok to put it this way, i am absolutely furious with people who crack games. earlier today, i was on a klango group and came accross a group that discussed cracks. I put in my views about cracking games in there, and said it is wrong. I got people saying they don't have enough money to buy the game, but to me that is no excuse. People should not! crack. And then i posted again, and they came back with a negative reply again and said they would bann me, and they did. I am just furious with the people who want to crack games. I have nothing else to say. I wanted to report the group to someone, but i can't now that i'm banned. I hope people never crack games, because it is just bad.

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2011-05-18 00:01:21

Why the hell would they ban you over something that you believe is wrong? However, i think that simply expressing your view in a forum will not change people's attitudes on cracking games. The reality of it is, people will and always find a way around paying money.

2011-05-18 01:27:52

Unfortunately Arq is right, some people are just scummy gits who don't really appreciate the work that goes into game developement.

That's why this forum has such a strong policy on discussing cracks.

I'd actually suggest contacting the Klango admins, sinse being developers themselves they should appreciate the issue.

While this won't stop people cracking games generally, it might at least stop them discussing such in a public forum like Klango.

Oh and yes, you shouldn't have been banned for expressing an opinion, not if you were (as I presume you would be), polite and not insulting about the matter.

With our dreaming and singing, Ceaseless and sorrowless we! The glory about us clinging Of the glorious futures we see,
Our souls with high music ringing; O men! It must ever be
That we dwell in our dreaming and singing, A little apart from ye. (Arthur O'Shaughnessy 1873.)

2011-05-18 12:06:22

I don't know why people are all over other people about cracking. I don't see the companies that make for-pay games losing money, and I know people who crack games day in and day out. I don't see Munawar Bajani asking for welfare money. That's because there are nice people like you guys who pay. I also know that the companies don't necessarily have to charge. I make free games that are equivalent or above some for-pay stuff. I also know that my games are more popular than the for-pay companies' games. But I don't know why you would be banned for just expressing your opinions. I mean, I believe in free speech as much as any sane person should.

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2011-05-18 14:36:23

Hi,
I have to hugely disagree. Cracking is, quite simply, stealing. You have jsut bought something fr no money at all--the fact that the developer isn't asking for welfare money is irrelevant.
Heck, why don't I just go down to my local departnent store and start robbing them bilnd? After all, tehy aren't loving on welfare.
I'm shocked you got banned for something liek that; I'd contact the admins myself about that topic.

Best Regards,
Hayden

2011-05-18 17:21:36 (edited by bryant 2011-05-18 17:26:29)

Where can i contact them at? Yes. If you don't have enough money, cracking is no excuse. Wait untill you have enough money to buy it. I agree 100 percent with hayden. THe less people crack, the more money the developer will get and the more support he/she will get. If people crack, how is the developer supposed to make money? Yes, i was quite polite about the matter, but i did say any farther discussion of cracks and i may consider reporting that group

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2011-05-18 17:31:50

The issue with cracking games is that developers of accessible games will not sell many of them anyway. Developement tools such as bgt cost money, apart from sound libraries etc, and apart from the fact of the time, trouble and effort the developer puts into their work.

That is really the issue. Look at Entombed, which was very costly to make both in time and in financial resources, future developement there actually depended upon jason making his targit of five hundred copies. he did make this, ---- but only just, and people cracking the game very much wouldn't have helped at all.

This is why the position on game cracks is so profoundly serious.

As Tom ward said, he's spent a couple of thousand dollars already buying developer tools for mota, and is likely to only sell two or three hundred copies at most, thus to avoid throwing cash down the drain he actually needs to recoop the costs, ---- and this is aside from games like railracer or blind adrenalin cardroom which run on a server basis and have thus continual monthly costs just to keep going.

As to your point about making free games yourself, remember that your games use other peoples' sfx and music from copywrited material, as well as require the free version of bgt.

Should there come a point that you want to expand into using the paid version, get in actors oor musicians, buy your own sound libraries etc, at that point you will have to pay.

This is personally why i also try myself to support independent projects financially if I can, and why I also try to give my time and help with voice acting etc on my own time.

With our dreaming and singing, Ceaseless and sorrowless we! The glory about us clinging Of the glorious futures we see,
Our souls with high music ringing; O men! It must ever be
That we dwell in our dreaming and singing, A little apart from ye. (Arthur O'Shaughnessy 1873.)

2011-05-18 17:36:03

now with grizley gulch and chillingham i can understand why people crack them, that's a different and long story with in its self

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2011-05-18 18:42:33

I've got three projects that I'm currently trying to work on (Except, you know, that I've been playing Lunimals for the past several hours. XD ). One is supposed to be a relatively short and free game, and the actors involved were all informed of this in the audition post. The second is one I've been struggling to get off the ground for a good decade, now, and I'm trying to find whatever ways I can of cutting costs--it'll need a lot of actors, and my goal is to make it graphical as well as accessible with only audio. The person who's agreed to work on the graphics has said she can probably do it for cheaper than her usual rates, but that's still quite a bit. I'm hoping I can arrange it to get academic credit for college students to help with vocals (and hopefully translations), which I would hope would cut costs further.
The third is considerably less urgent, so who knows when (or if, even) it'll see the light of day, but if it's anywhere near what my notes describe, there will be a lot of cost in terms of voices at least. In the extremely unlikely event I get enough money, I'd like to get better quality music for it than my own devices can provide.
These last two would pretty much have to make money to break even.
I'm more concerned about making something that people can enjoy than making money. Positive feedback is far more rewarding. But coming up with quality for cheap is extremely difficult.
So if I manage to release these games, and people pirate them, I'll certainly be glad that someone is that interested in something I made, provided I'm not having to sell everything I own to pay off the production costs...!

看過來!
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MaxAngor wrote:
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2011-05-18 18:46:45

Honestly, i wouldn't mind paying for a downloadable version of chillingham or grizly gulch if bavisoft were still around and had that available. There is nothing wrong with the games and if they showed that they were in the comunity again, i wouldn't mind paying for there products.

2011-05-20 13:58:03

Cracking games in many cases is like photocopying a few hundred or thousand copies of a popular magazine or newspaper and handing them out for free. Except of course it doesn't cost the cracker any money to distribute it.

There are indeed cases where games aren't worth the money for the quality or there are free alternatives which are better, cough azabat cough. The best way to deal with these companies is simply to promote the free alternatives as another option, this could equally apply to NVDA and Jaws for many people.

Bavisoft by contrast is an exercise in frustration. They make games which a lot of people have enjoyed immensely but refuse to rearrange their distribution and purchasing system into one which actually works, at all. Similarly mainstream games which require online activation with a limited number of activations, and in some cases won't run at all in an offline environment encourage much more cracking as an objection to the draconian copy protection. This is something of a grey area where you want to enjoy the product but the company makes it very difficult for you to do so. In these cases I'm disinclined to pass judgement, I have a lot of sympathy here.

cx2
-----
To live by honour and to honour life, these are our greatest strengths and our best hopes.

2011-05-20 14:35:29

Hi CX2,
There, I have to agree with hyou. I am usually opposed to cracking anything, but in the case of MS Windows and such other products li9ke JFW, there is definitely a gray area.

Best Regards,
Hayden

2011-05-20 16:43:30

That gets me thinking about how much i don't like playing online only games. Mostly because, i don't particularly want to have to throw money down while relying on somebody's server or the continuation of that server. In other words, you can't control anything that isn't on your end of the game. Its like when the playstation network went down, a lot of people just thought there lives were over because they couldn't play a certain game. I personally don't use the network but my point is, why pay money for an online game. What happened to the old days where people would invite there friends over for a good time. Sorry had to rant there.

2011-05-20 17:38:05

The internet happened. sad
And arcades became a thing of the past.
Well, at least they're still making arcade games in Japan...

看過來!
"If you want utopia but reality gives you Lovecraft, you don't give up, you carve your utopia out of the corpses of dead gods."
MaxAngor wrote:
    George... Don't do that.

2011-05-20 19:02:30

It is very much a personal preference thing. Some of us still do prefer having someone physically with us, some of us aren't so bothered. It isn't about being stuck in the past or not.

Plus you can't throw something at someone over the internet tongue That's a round about way of saying you can't have the traditional horse play.

cx2
-----
To live by honour and to honour life, these are our greatest strengths and our best hopes.