2019-09-10 04:46:48

Okay just a quick question here.
I recently finished the story mode of audio wizards, and it was obvious who the big bad guy was going to be, since inevitably once sondaman started talking about "the principle" we knew he was going to be eeeeeevil!

This  seems to be something of a trope in audiogames. Echoes of Livia, heck even in arcade titles like Q9 and going back as far as pipe 2. If there's going to be a betrayal, its always either the guy in charge, or the person/thing helping you out, (I really hope it doesn't turn out that Shepherd is evil in the vale).

So I thought we could have a bit of fun in this topic suggesting who might be evil next, given general game characters.
Here are some thoughts:

The shop keeper:  I remember when watching  someone play through Secret of Mana as a teenager. Wots the blacksmith follows you around everywhere, he tells you he's the only person able to unlock the mystical power of your weapons, meaning that every time you pick up a new upgrade orb you need to bring it to him and pay massive amounts to get your upgrade.
I always wondered if at the end when you go to confront the bad guys, you'd return to find that with the massive amounts of cash you've given him throughout the game,   bought out the entire world, and enslaved the hole population in giant factories to make yet more weapons to extend his economic empire!

Now an evil shop keeper,  that would be a twist. Actually of all places Grizly gulch managed to do this with the black jack dealer being the final boss, albeit just as much of a  one  shot push over as everyone else in the game.

Damsel's father: I've seen it occasionally that when your tasked to go and rescue the princess (occasionally prince but more often princess), she turns out to either be tough as nails and join you on your adventure, or turn out to be eeeeevil! all the time.

How about though, the princess's father? After all princesses usually tend to be rather bratty, and what better way to get rid of a spoiled child, or maybe if the princess is the tough as nails sort, having her kidnapped is a good way to get rid of a rival, you the hero are a useful token gesture to show people father is actually doing something about getting his daughter back, provided of course you don't actually succeed.

Evil church cleaner: again we've all seen the plot where the holy order of the god of goodness sends you off after the McGuffin, only to reveal  the head of the order is really evil!
But really,  if an evil god could infiltrate their rival's church far enough to put one of their own worshippers in the highest position, why on earth would they need the McGuffin anyway?

Imagine though, you just make it back into the temple, and there's the random boy/girl cleaning the alter, you saw them on your first trip, maybe you had to get them a random quest object to go and see the high head.
When you enter with the McGuffin, the cleaner offers to take you to the high head, only she/he take s takes you somewhere else and transforms.

Synthesiser: here's one for the arcade games. Almost everyone wants human voicing in games, and synths are just used to read score. Well as we've said, we've seen an evil game voice, but how about an evil score poster?
I'magine, you've just finished  the arcade game, killed off the big boss and the voice says "your score is"
Then suddenly: "ha ha ha! zero because your dead!" and your suddenly thrust into another boss battle against your friendly neighborhood screen reader, who turns out to be eeeeevil! all the time big_smile.

Any other suggestions for changing things up so that its not always the guy in charge?

With our dreaming and singing, Ceaseless and sorrowless we! The glory about us clinging Of the glorious futures we see,
Our souls with high music ringing; O men! It must ever be
That we dwell in our dreaming and singing, A little apart from ye. (Arthur O'Shaughnessy 1873.)

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2019-09-10 05:01:01

Random guess: I feel like Theo in the Vale is gonna be  evil. While he seems to be caring, it feels like he may have been frustrated with his father and how he treated you, but you (Alexander/Alexandra) don't agree with the way he retaliates.

A winner is you!
—Urban Champion

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2019-09-10 07:44:46

manamon, dr. murets gathers the data that she reseaved from you and creates  mechanical manamon including irrodium
then you gotta fight with eachother

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2019-09-10 10:16:42

Oh you forgot to mention A Hero's Call big_smile being the final boss a shocking surprise in some games is a nice concept, but it becomes tedious when that happens with every new game. I mean, it's even fun when you know who your main enemy Is, right?

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2019-09-10 10:16:46

The Tutorial: Tutorials are always so hellpful. What if the tutorial only shows you basic movement and attack keys, but later, during the final boss fight, it returns like "Did you know you have the ability to kill every enemy in this game with your super atomic wave of nuclear hyperdestruction technique? But I didn't tell you because I'm eeeeeeeevil! Muhahahaha. Now figure out the five-key command yourself, I know you can do it."

We are pleased, that you made it through the final challenge, where we pretended we were going to murder you. We are throwing a party in honor of your tremendous success. Place the device on the ground, then lay on your stomach with your arms at your sides. A party associate will arrive shortly to collect you for your party. Assume the party submission position or you will miss the party.

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2019-09-10 13:21:30

Q9's tutorial guy is evil too

2019-09-10 14:02:13

Adventure at c’s tutorial guy is also evil.
After teaching the player about all the controls of the game, the player is forced to fight it in the program files boss

when the shrine is in chaos,
a pack of unusual wolves will save it,
they go to different worlds, collect rubies, fighting various creatures and learning new and unusual abilities,
I am the kurtwolf cubscout! with all the rubies the world will soon back to it's normal form!

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2019-09-10 14:09:53

We actually have all kinds of evil here. Bad guys behind the mask, the obvious ones, those who use you, but we don't have one kind in our audiogames community. If you look at especially horror genres with super complex plots, like silent hill, you'll see even more bizarre kinds everywhere. Take Claudia wolf for example. She's actually not evil from the start but she's brainwshed by a bitch like Dahlia, +her separation from Alessa and her bastard father made her that way. Walter Sullivan was obsessed abou finding his own mom, and look what happened? He too was brainwashed, and even more brainwashed than Claudia. But at least these don't try to brainwash you as a player too, except in claudia's case. But then again, Claudia only brought out Heather's past and stuff. Walter is pretty straight forward. "You are just my sacrifice, and that's it."
Now what about someone who actually accompany you, not necessarily helping or using you the way that shhh guy in a hero's call does, but giving hints to this and that and may occasionally guide you. Slowly, you become influenced by that person, may even go as far as falling in love etc. But you never know until the end that you're actually manipulated all the while and brainwashed to the point of merely nothing but a tool, a bit like Zidane in ff9 who was created as a tool for Garland. But at least Zidane isn't brainwashed.
Or, taken from my own novel, there's this one organization consists of mages and armed forces, that serves as police force for a country. Then one day, the son of that organization leader secretly plot to take over that organization, injures his big brother who loves him to death, expels and sends his just and fair father into hiding. Everyone in the whole country thinks this guy is a complete evil. But then it's revealed much later that he too has been manipulated by a person who was blessed by a mage of the past to be able to die and rebirth as the same person twice, who reborn to seek vengeance upon the bloodline of those who destroyed his family and took control of the land he wanted to control. This guy who harmed and scattered his own family at one point saught after power that would make him more powerful and respected than his big bro, and he was offered that power by this mage. But little did he know that the offering had to be exchange with his freedom to be himself, as the mage takes most control of him and merges with his body, making it look like the young bro himself is the one causing chaos upon the land. Then this same mage would manipulate the guy's big brother who recovered to kill a person he loves so dearly...I'd rather not spoil the plot further lol. Just giving example of how evil concept can be done.
But then I have another example. This may not look like super dark evil or anything, but it's still kinda evil, and is taken from another novel plot of mine. So there's an entity that sees a lady talking to her tree everyday and knows that the tree too is in love with the lady. So it decides to give the tree a chance to communicate and spend time with the lady as human. It turns the tree with its power, sending him to learn a way of man in the world. The lady takes the man, who she suspects to be an amnesiac homeless in out of mercy, and teaches him everything rom how to talk to how to be a good person, and their relationship grows as they progress through the story. But little do they know, in exchange of him being human, everytime he helps someone, his power returns to the entiry who gave him that power. He presses on, spending his power little by little in happiness of being good, until one day, when it's time for the entity to take him back to where he originates...and mercilessly wipe every memory of his, leaving him once again as nothing but a tall round teek...and I'm gonna leave it at that.
I can probably come up with a few more from games or animes I play, but hey, you too can imagine as much right?

My sskype : mars.bhuntamata, add away buddy. If you think you are crazy, I am as well. I may be even crazier, who knows.

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2019-09-10 15:01:03

How about in a game that takes place in a school or something, the bullied doofus kid is actually an evil jerk and although they might not be being bullied because they're a jerk, in the long run, they do deserve it.

Or how about CrazyParty's battle arenas, it isn't just a random competition but in fact, as you defeat each arena you are unleashing an elder evil that is comprised of all 18 prime elements (types) and the Grand council isn't some final competition but in fact is the world's last line of defense. When you beat them, a wicked wave surges over the world, and you must play through the 18 arenas and fight a warped and crazed cult of grand councilors to put the creature back. Before you do this, the entire soundtrack of Crazyparty would change with erie music, bizarre sound effects, and the random scream as the world falls apart around the theoretical character.

Perhaps this could be altered for adventure mode too, or the battle quest coud wind up with you unintentionally helping a tyrant into power as you raid the castle for bots.

Not sure what to say about the board mode, it doesn't have enough meat to make a story around it yet.

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2019-09-10 15:44:49

This design of "We take a very light-hearted and funny game and suddenly turn it into a deeply disturbing experience", as suggested with Crazy Party, is a really great idea. Mainstream did this with Doki Doki Literature Club, or, to a lesser extend, Undertale.

We are pleased, that you made it through the final challenge, where we pretended we were going to murder you. We are throwing a party in honor of your tremendous success. Place the device on the ground, then lay on your stomach with your arms at your sides. A party associate will arrive shortly to collect you for your party. Assume the party submission position or you will miss the party.

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2019-09-10 20:30:47 (edited by Dark 2019-09-10 20:37:58)

I think  examples of adventure at C etc prove my point, why is it always the person giving you instructions that is eeeevil! is this some sort of hidden "I want to kill my boss" revenge fantasy or something that so many people are playing out? big_smile.

Obviously in more complex stories you can have more detailed villains, actually I like the idea of the villain being someone who you think is a miner victim, not necessarily a damsel or something like just someone who vaguely gets a bit pushed around or bullied and then turns out to be a bad guy.

I think though the best suggestion so far is the idea of evil crazy party, with it turning out that you thought you were just competing in a game, but taking out  the defences against the vil monsters of doom! Yes, I'd really love to see  chaotic party, I mean, can you imagine the worlds in adventure mode?
The violent valley, castle creep, life's a beach, mirc forest, underworld, the hates, circus dangerous, the punishment factory, spook cityy, evil ice, depressing desert, the volcano of hell and the plane, which is definitely evil enough already. Oh and just as complete contrast instead of the darkness you could have the fluffiness, a world of rainbows and unicorns and twinkly things with minigames like kittens arena, happy forest (in which you must avoid disappearing and reappearing fairies and jump over puppies), and of course the cute field, where you must get from one end of the field to the other without stopping to pet the cute furry kittens who are so snuggly that you can't resist stopping to stroke them forever, ---- that is why the field is littered with the skeletal remains of all those who tried and failed before you, (hay those kittens have to have bone toys to play with and kitty snacks).

With our dreaming and singing, Ceaseless and sorrowless we! The glory about us clinging Of the glorious futures we see,
Our souls with high music ringing; O men! It must ever be
That we dwell in our dreaming and singing, A little apart from ye. (Arthur O'Shaughnessy 1873.)

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2019-09-10 23:56:47 (edited by defender 2019-09-11 18:16:28)

What if Caroline from A Blind Legend, actually orchestrated her own capture because she was tired of Edward Blake's shit for what ever reason and wanted to be queen.
Then she could either come in and save the king right before he dies, or when the king was defeated she could come in for an embrace, and pull a hidden stiletto to kill Blake.
The game would end with either her throwing her daughter out on the street/into a home for children, or imprisoning her and trying to convince her to accept her new father.  Both of which could make for good sequels if you played as the daughter in order to escape and take revenge.


Or how about in treasure hunt, when you win you get killed by a bombing raid or an assassin as you exit the building, and it's revealed that Munawar's radio contact was actually just trying to get rid of him at the request of the organization he works for because of something he knows that he shouldn't, and while the mission was real, it was a double cross where they colluded with Brutas and told him to expect Munawar, but then dropped Munawar off in the wrong location and with better weapons so that they could take care of both problems at once by pitting them against each other, but were ready to step in and finish who ever survived if necessary.


Or what if at the end of Super Liam, just before he's about to kill X1, it's explained that X1 was created by DR. Quark for the military and exiled to another dimension when he could not be controlled.  He hates Super Liam because he is a pawn of DR. Quark hence why he has treated him this way, but all he really wants is autonomy, so he offers to give Super Liam cybernetic enhancements and a spot as the admiral of his space ship fleet if he will betray Quark and destroy the teleporter that allowed him to get here so that no one else can try to attack X1.


What if at the end of Shades of Doom, it's revealed that it was all just a test that was run on others as well, to see if you would be a good candidate for mutation into a super soldier for the federation mentioned at the start of the game.
This could lead into a sequel where you break from their control before the process is complete and must fight them directly to escape and get answers about your new powers and how to regain your humanity.


This is pretty fun!

Buy the worlds greatest machine gun. It's about 50 inches in length, It's huge! & it can shoot really far, &, it's cheap!
Lets demonstrate this: stand still Thom...
Okay ma.aaa!
Oh! crap!

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2019-09-11 05:18:26

I just wish entombed 2 was worked on and done already, to see what kind of evil would be at the end of the game, lol.
You know one kind of evil I kinda like and lol at? If you play lost til the end of the game lol. Like he's nothing but a typical kind of evil but he's kinda ridiculously hilarious.

There're a few games I actually need to complete to be able to voice more opinions on the kind of evil we lack in our community. But heck, if only I knew how to make games like that on my own, I would try my best not to disappoint you with stories, lol. You know what I wish to see more in our community? The very deep kind of evil in horror genre that aren't the type to release typical zombies and vampires and everything all over the place just so they can destroy the world or take over it. Not that I have anything against them. Roy Curien in house of the dead is one. Hades in the gate is one. It's especially popular in videogames, and can of course be carried over to audiogames. And since we don't have many horror or mystery genres, which is honestly sad, I don't want to see more of them the typical fps killing zombies all over the map kind. You know what we have the most? Fps. Everyone develops that. I don't have anything against these games but man, for once, can I play something with reasons and feelings without having to think of the score board or be the best playerkiller? And, for hell's sake, Mason's tombhunter could have been more fun if it made more sense and had more stories than those 5 lines before the game starts. Anyone can develop 250 levels with whatever challenge they want to throw in. Oh yeah I'm gonna make levels after levels like that. But do you ever think of something that makes sense out of those challenges you threw in? So this whoever guy went to explore the tomb, but then he emerged seomewhere else with robots and stuff, probably a robot factory, but still thought he was in the tomb because he didn't remember that he was taken there. Turns out, the tomb was a trap. The urge he got to explore that tomb was actually induced by a feeling manipulation machine in order to lure him to the tomb to be captured, tested and turned into a next generation of computerized robot in expense of his own mind. Whatever, I just tried to come up with bs to make sense out of that game.

My sskype : mars.bhuntamata, add away buddy. If you think you are crazy, I am as well. I may be even crazier, who knows.

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2019-09-11 14:04:32

Well....if we're talking games in general. VTM: BLoodlines 1 (it's weird to think that sequel is FINALLY coming!) had this in spades. Troika knew their shit about this. And yeah, it's a trope alright.

VTM:B had you taking orders from a Ventrue vampire who sent you off to do all this story stuff. Endgame, he's the one pulling the strings. Which was amusing to say the least.

For evil tutorials, videos of FC3 Blood Dragon and the reactions of the main character to it. Made me laugh out loud when I went through a LP series on it. It captures the feeling of godawful tutorials. Also, Kreiya from KOTOR2, and a lesser extent, KOTOR1. Both villains are on the install discs, but they're sooooo helpful.

Yep, games as a whole been doing this for ages. And ages, and ages...and no I didn't restrict myself to audiogames. I went for games as a whole

If in doubt, chocolate and coffee. Enough said.

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2019-09-11 14:14:04

your mother in the gate
after you deffete all those broken monster, your mom reserects in frunt of you and opens the gate that you closed
huh, a weird one ok

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2019-09-11 14:59:47

Or patrick's mother being corrupted and absorbed by Hades and transforms into the even more powerful god form of him.

My sskype : mars.bhuntamata, add away buddy. If you think you are crazy, I am as well. I may be even crazier, who knows.

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