2015-04-21 00:00:55

Hi Dingo and others,
I'd really like to see a "check for updates" option in the main menu. That way, we could just update directly from Entombed2 and not have to download any setup files unless the setup file was needed.

"On two occasions I have been asked [by members of Parliament!]: 'Pray, Mr. Babbage, if you put into the machine wrong figures, will the right answers come out ?' I am not able rightly to apprehend the kind of confusion of ideas that could provoke such a question."    — Charles Babbage.
My Github

2015-04-21 00:02:57 (edited by Chris 2015-04-21 00:04:29)

I managed to get the game to work by downloading it directly with Windows. I guess Safari was doing weird stuff to the file putting .msi.exe at the end of it.

Anyway, I'm having the same issues as everyone else with the menu. WHen I'm in the actual game and press escape, it just has the start and exit options. What's going on here?

Also, the sounds for walls and steps appear to be very quiet compared to the door sounds. I'm also wondering how you know if a door is in front or behind you. I can't really tell, so just have to push up or down arrow to go through the door. THe door sound itself is odd since it plays the door open and close sound even if you're in the doorway. Is this by design or is it a glitch? I was expecting doors to operate like they did in the original Entombed.

One more thing, why do rooms have more than one door leading out of them. Is this a bug or by design?

Still, this looks promising. I'm excited for a Mac version and to see what comes next.

Grab my Adventure at C: stages Right here.

2015-04-21 00:24:37

@Chris, entombed 1 had plenty of rooms with multiple doors, all just part of random dungeon generation, I imagine entombed 2 is the same, indeed I'm a tad  confused what you mean about this being a bug, though I do agree with you about changing the door sounds in front or behind the character, a lower door sound for doors to the south like the lower wind sound might help here.

@Ethin,  While a check for updates option might sound a nice idea, it might cause issues later on, if people start heavily modding the game and monkeying with lua scripting, after all the last thing you'd want after creating your carefully scripted mod would be for Jason to release an update and you finding your scripts got over written by newer versions. I also confess in cases where to update it's only necessary to redownload and run the setup I always rather wonder if a "check for updates" option is overkill, though obviously it can be very handy if it can automatically download many files you'd otherwise need to add automatically, like the MushZ updater for Alteraeon.

With our dreaming and singing, Ceaseless and sorrowless we! The glory about us clinging Of the glorious futures we see,
Our souls with high music ringing; O men! It must ever be
That we dwell in our dreaming and singing, A little apart from ye. (Arthur O'Shaughnessy 1873.)

2015-04-21 00:36:26

Hi.

Dark, that's true. I thought each room along this circular path only had one door to go in and out from. It seems like this new layout is a little different. So, do the other doors in the room go back to the hallway like in Entombed, or do they link to other rooms? I'll have to play with this some more.

Grab my Adventure at C: stages Right here.

2015-04-21 00:37:34 (edited by Glein 2015-04-21 00:38:39)

Oh Yay! What a good news! The first entombed i loved, i finished the game completely. So a Entombed 2 would be perfect! And even more with the feature to add languages, as well the people that speak Spanish we can play without problem. I promise that we will make a good translation smile

Cristian.

2015-04-21 01:20:02

Don't get too worried about things that aren't right in this little technical test version. I'll be changing things rapidly.

As for the doors opening and closing, it just seemed less complicated to assume you've moved through a door instead of having the door frame as a space. I also considered opening doors and not shutting them. That way you know if you've passed that way because you're not opening them again.

Rooms are a special case in Entombed 2. Rooms are where interesting things happen. I don't know if you can hear it well enough, but there is a 3D ambient sound of water running. That sound is handled differently from the wind, door, and footstep sounds in that it is fully 3D and is more nuanced than just a sound left, right, up, or down. The only 3D sound Entombed 1 had was the dragon breathing. I'm hoping to expand that with Entombed 2. So I think I'm going to make an ambient 3D sound for unexplored rooms so you can find them easier subtly and know when there are no more to be explored.

2015-04-21 02:41:18

I like the new layout. It took some getting used to, but I can get around rooms quite nicely. 1 question, though. Will there be a room linking system, like chris mentioned? It would be cool to have linking rooms, instead of just 1 room by itself. It would also be cool to have some rooms that are huge, and some that contain a whole stampeed of enemies when you enter the room, like 5 or 6, that you have to fight off in order to get past. This game is really awesome and I look forward to the final product when it comes out!

--------------------
All of my socials and content platforms can be found on my website (not ready yet).

2015-04-21 03:00:03

Dingo, if you like, I'd be happy to host your entombed setup files for you. I'd even go as far as hosting a web site for it.

"On two occasions I have been asked [by members of Parliament!]: 'Pray, Mr. Babbage, if you put into the machine wrong figures, will the right answers come out ?' I am not able rightly to apprehend the kind of confusion of ideas that could provoke such a question."    — Charles Babbage.
My Github

2015-04-21 03:03:33

@garret, Some rooms do appear next to each other occasionally. In Entombed 1, a room was just a matrix of spaces that had nothing special about them. Even when you tried to pick something up, the game would first walk over all the tiles in the room and collect all the items into one pile so you didn't have to manually walk over each one.

In Entombed 2, navigating a room is only one movement (this is to prevent tedious exploration) and all items don't need to be grouped together from multiple spaces. However, where Entombed 1 didn't have anything particularly special about a room other than its size, many interactions in Entombed 2 will be tied to rooms.

It's entirely possible to enter a room and end up with a large encounter with unfriendly goblins, or worse. Rooms can also contain treasure chests and be hidden. Rooms might also have traps. They'll also have descriptions, and possibly an ambient sound so you can find them from further away.

2015-04-21 03:18:26

You are exciting me further with every word sir, I can't wait!

Stevie-3

2015-04-21 03:32:44

Hello.

I like the idea that rooms have individual ambience sounds. This will make the envrionment much more interesting than it was in the original game. Also, how many floors will this game have? What do you mean when you say that the rooms are one action? I'm not quite following.

Grab my Adventure at C: stages Right here.

2015-04-21 09:29:05

Hi,
The step sounds seams misplaced. When I walk up, left or down for instance, I hear the step sound from the half left. Please add disabling 3-d mode for windows 7 or 8.1. I use windows 8.1 pro 64 bit and Realtek sound card. The door sounds are misplaced also. And the water sound doesn't go anywhere. So its important to add a disable 3-d option.

2015-04-21 10:15:02

@Dingo, I could tell the water sound was moving but not to a specific location. I do however very much like the idea of rooms with interesting stuff in very much, although I do rather wonder what will happen when your in range of 5 or 6 different rooms all making sounds. One idea for this (and an expantion on the environment idea0, might be to have the ambient sounds detectable according to character ability. So for example, if you have a detect monsters, detect treasure or detect traps spell, or a rogue or thief with no abilities you hear the correct sounds from rooms around you when you use it, (assuming the ability is of sufficient level), but obviously if not you'll just have to guess. This insures that you only hear the sounds when you physically desire to, and so won't be overloaded with 3D sounds, and adds another level of environmental interaction in the game with for example the possibility of characters who are less good in combat but have very good detection/unlock/disarming skills.

You wouldn't even need that many sounds, just say a clink of coins for treasure, a gas puff or stone grinding sound for a trap, and a short growl for monsters, (indeed you could even grade this by making it detect specific to specific monsters by having it play a clip of their voice).

I think the door's perminantly open idea is a good one as well, sinse that does resolve one of the exploration issues with the game, plus it would more easily let you have locked doors that either need a key or need unlocking with a pick locks skill and distinguish them.

so, definitely sounding awsome!

With our dreaming and singing, Ceaseless and sorrowless we! The glory about us clinging Of the glorious futures we see,
Our souls with high music ringing; O men! It must ever be
That we dwell in our dreaming and singing, A little apart from ye. (Arthur O'Shaughnessy 1873.)

2015-04-21 10:36:54

Detectable environment sounds based on ability is a killer idea. I love that. And limiting sound overload is also a great idea.

So I've hit a snag with the Mac version. To use text to speech on Mac, I have to fire off the sentences one at a time. They don't wait for each other. So the TTS can speak over itself. This is really irritating but there are no options for interrupting the speech engine once it is running. I think this is a problem for some screen readers too. Does the Windows version talk over itself when using a screen reader? Is it not that big of a deal?

If no one really cares, I can release the Mac test version soon.

2015-04-21 10:47:28

Neither sapi nor Supernova spoke over each other. I'm not sure if Supernova can (at least I've used the thing for  going on 20 years and haven't heard the thing do so), but I know sapi can, though it didn't in entombed, so it must be a mac thing.

With our dreaming and singing, Ceaseless and sorrowless we! The glory about us clinging Of the glorious futures we see,
Our souls with high music ringing; O men! It must ever be
That we dwell in our dreaming and singing, A little apart from ye. (Arthur O'Shaughnessy 1873.)

2015-04-21 11:07:12

I think I found a pretty decent solution. Still experimenting with it. Nice to hear Entombed 2 running on a Mac.

2015-04-21 11:46:08

Hi.
I ghaven't had time to try the test version yet, but I hope I get time to try it later today. I would love to test a mac version as well.

Best regards SLJ.
Feel free to contact me privately if you have something in mind. If you do so, then please send me a mail instead of using the private message on the forum, since I don't check those very often.
Facebook: https://facebook.com/sorenjensen1988
Twitter: https://twitter.com/soerenjensen

2015-04-21 12:13:07

@Dingo, I tried the latest version, (I know there weren't major changes but I do want to help with the testing as much as possible). I like the door sounds and I do see that some balance of the step sounds has been done (I didn't find this a problem myself sinse I have some amazingly good earphones). I also noticed the water seemed more detectable by direction, and I definitely like the new door sounds.

however, there were two sound related matters I noticed. Firstly, when you walked into a wall, you did get the sound on the left or right, however when the wall was below you the game would repeat the last panned sound. So, for example if I was in a left bottom corner, if I hit left arrow to walk into the leftwall I get the wall sound on the left, but then if I hit down arrow I get the same left wall sound. This also happened with rightwards sounds, though from what I gathered didn't happen with walls above you.
I'm afraid I'm also still! not seeing this menu to switch screen reading methods,  hitting escape just brings up the menu with exit and start (and for some reason I can't exit that menu other than by hitting start because hitting escape again doesn't work), both right and left and up and down arrows switch between those two options, and the only way to choose whether the game uses supernova or sapi is to start it running with supernova or not.

With our dreaming and singing, Ceaseless and sorrowless we! The glory about us clinging Of the glorious futures we see,
Our souls with high music ringing; O men! It must ever be
That we dwell in our dreaming and singing, A little apart from ye. (Arthur O'Shaughnessy 1873.)

2015-04-21 12:57:32

As far as Mac speech goes, I don't mind it interrupting. I'm not sure how you're accessing it - just calling the say terminal app or calling the NSSpeechSynthesizer class  or speaking directly through VoiceOver, but there are some ways of fixing this. The NS Speech synthesiser class has an IsSpeaking property that you should be able to check. No idea how well it works as I've recently noticed that some games like change reaction, which used to speak properly are now interrupting their messages. Could be some kind of change in Yosemite that Draconis hasn't addressed. If you're speaking through VoiceOver, I don't think there is much you can do, short of just using the speech synth directly which wouldn't be all that noticeable. Directly supporting screen readers isn't as big of a deal on the mac as it is on Windows and the few speaking audio games there are just use the synth.
I'm definitely looking forward to trying out the mac test version, whenever it comes. There's a definite shortage of mac audio games, so the more the better.

<Insert passage from "The Book Of Chrome" here>

2015-04-21 13:24:16

Here is the Mac test version for anyone who would like to try it: http://endpermian.com/e2/Entombed2MacOS.zip

Just unzip the file somewhere and run E2. It should then open the game. This version is a little newer than the Windows one and has remixed sounds. Entombed will use your default system voice and you can change the rate of speech using the + and - keys.

@pitermach, I am accessing it directly in the terminal app. I'm not sure how to use native libraries on OSX and I'm not familiar enough with native development to create them. It would be great to have a plugin wrapper for Unity for TTS on the Mac, but using the app directly seems to be working pretty well. I wrote some clever (I might be be bias) code that prevents a lot of the TTS speaking over itself. I'm already trying to avoid waiting for text to finish, so this might really work a treat.

Please let me know how you go with the Mac version. I've only tested it on my relatively new desktop but it should work on most Macs. Oh, this is for Intel (x86) Macs only. Most Macs built in the last few years are Intel so if you're not sure, you're probably fine.

2015-04-21 13:53:52

Like Dark, I'm not seeing anywhere to manually change from NVDA to TTS, hitting escape only shows start and exit.
I'm loving the reawakening of this game.

2015-04-21 15:39:57

Oh, Wow! Dingo, could you port this to Linux, too? I've got a 3 TB hard drive at home that I'm considering installing a Linux distribution on.

"On two occasions I have been asked [by members of Parliament!]: 'Pray, Mr. Babbage, if you put into the machine wrong figures, will the right answers come out ?' I am not able rightly to apprehend the kind of confusion of ideas that could provoke such a question."    — Charles Babbage.
My Github

2015-04-21 17:46:32 (edited by Chris 2015-04-21 17:48:18)

Hello.

Here are my comments on the Mac version. The game runs just fine on my 2013 Macbook Air running Yosemite. The only thing I've noticed is that the game uses significant energy according to the battery status menu. I also noticed that it uses a lot of ram and CPU. Other than that, it works just fine.

Just for kicks, I'm going to try this on my late 2006 intel Mac Mini running Leopard and Snow Leopard. This probably won't matter for most folks since these OS X versions are so old, but I'm just going to try.

As always, keep up the great work. THe more audiogames for multiple platforms the better.

Grab my Adventure at C: stages Right here.

2015-04-21 17:50:37

If Unity was accessible to the blind, I'd gladly use it for the games I want to create. Sadly, there are no accessible game engines out there...

"On two occasions I have been asked [by members of Parliament!]: 'Pray, Mr. Babbage, if you put into the machine wrong figures, will the right answers come out ?' I am not able rightly to apprehend the kind of confusion of ideas that could provoke such a question."    — Charles Babbage.
My Github

2015-04-21 18:16:50

Hi jason.
I am happy that entombed is still a live, I can not wait for any testing version, where I will fight against some enemies.
Also I have a question are you going to make the bazaar the same as in first part of entombed?
Also I have a suggestion about using some special techniques.
Every profession has some special techniques, or spells if your profession has mac skills, but I am thinking that you can do some schools or trainings in this game, where you can train your special abilities.
For example you have special skill called ice blast and you have some training points, which you can spend to practice just that or another skill.
If your character will reache a level he will get some train points.
I think that it will make this game more interesting