hi,
I personally think that it is acceptable to demand entitlements that are garanteed by law
blindness is considered to be a severe disability due to the affect it has on one's  ability to due things
sure we can do most things that sighted people can
but we do things usually alot slower
also, the cost of a disability can be very high
this is why governments provide us with discounts on stuff
to provide us with equal access
there are some things that are mandatory for companies
like a 25% discount on all cable, dsl and fiber internet packages as well as phone packages
and a free pass for all city buses and metros
in this situation I would demand these entitlements since they are a right that the government provides us
however I would think it very wrong to ask for something that is not a wright under law
for example, free meals at restaurants
if these were given to me I would accept not to be rude but I wouldn't demand these things

Wow Enes I never realized the government was so nice in Turkey as regards providing financial assistance or requiring companies to do so.

Here in Britain, bus passes are free in some counties but not others sinse bus travel is administered by the county councel not the government at large and different councels have different ideas. There are disabled rail cards, but given the state of Britains very silly train system (we really do have the worst administered trains in europe), they only have some effect and are honoured on some services due to the many companies and confusing regulations that vary train travel.

For the Metro again it depends where you are. Newcastle metro is free, or at least they accept the free bus pass, but in London they certainly aren't. It would actually be helpful if the British government did indeed lay down some laws on this rather than leaving the decisions up to local councel's by laws.

I am also frankly amazed! to hear that in Turkey companies must sell blind people tv and phone packages for less, again, very much not the case over here, ---- even tv licenses which are paid to the government directly rather than to sky, virgin or one of the other companies have no reduction for blind people, (they used to but that changed in the late nineties).

This however illustrates the problem of saying "If I am legally entitled to something I will take it" sinse manifestly different countries have different laws which may allow for different things and when either campaigning that a law should be changed, or simply asking for something to which a person should be entitled even if the law hasn't caught up to that yet there doo need to be some higher moral principles in place.

For example, there is unfortunately no law! that says a game developer must make their game accessible, yet there are some very good ethical arguements as to why they should, equal access etc.

this is why I tend to think we need to sort out some reasonable personal ideas of what is equal access and what is unfare entitlement, sinse unfortunately the law isn't adequate to the task, it certainly should be, but that is not currently the case, and frequently it will be up to each individual blind person to argue the toss on her/his own.

@Cx2, there did used to be a similar reduction on licenses, essentially because if you couldn't see the tv you weren't getting your money's worth, but this was done away with in the nineties and unfortunately I don't see the government standing up to rupert merdock and the other fat cats any time soon.

Are you sure on that Cx2? When I moved into my flat in 2007, I was very much told by them that there were no reductions for having a visual imparement anymore, and certainly my parents don't get one, (my mum is also registered blind).

Of course, when i realized that  the tv license actually cost me more than buying Doctor who and Being human on dvd, and tthat I really wasn't watching much else besides the news occasionally, I dropped my license in 2009. Interestingly enough, you can still own a tv (sinse I use a large tv with a snes, gamecube and pc lplugged into it), just so long as you don't actually watch live tv on the thing.

I actually heard all about the loop holes sinse my brother has had some quite comical discussions with the licensing people. First when they attempted to claime that the solicitor's firm where my brother worked who used a tv and video for watching the interview and security tapes from crime cases had to pay a license, ---- not very clever, and then when they tell my brother they can inspect his property and might take him to court if he doesn't make himself available for inspecttion, again distinctly not clever!

Luckily sinse I told them flatly I didn't watch tv they haven't bothered me in five years, and sinse my parents have a sky plus box, on the rare occasions something does pop up that I do want to watch (doctor who, futurama, game of thrones), my parents can record it for me.

Mostly I just buy and watch series on dvd instead, right now I'm having a break through watching through ds9 to watch the Avatar the last air bender series (which is awsome).

Actually, there is so little that is any good on tv now, sinse so much of it is celebrity rubbish or reality tv rubbish or similar drek, I actually know lots of  sighted people who don't bother with a tv license either!

Well you might be correct, though to be honest I still doubt it'd make tv cheap enough to warrent the little that I bother watching the thing.

Reever doesn't really have an issue with needing background noise, partly because I'm in an upstares flat, so usually she'll wait for someone to actually start walking up the stairs before she got the idea they were coming, but mostly because she's just plane lazy anyway .

Well Reever does love people, but not more than lying down, so usually she waits until  someone walks up the stairs to get excited. The only exception to this was when my friends turned up for rp, and she'd start getting excited as soon as she heard their voices out side.

The Eastern world is indeed different but that doesn't necessarily equate to better, neither does it equate to worse.

Dark, I had no idea you were such an optimist.

If there's no practical way to either prevent a problem neither prepare for it you might as well just carry on as if the problem doesn't exist, it's the only way to keep sane in any case.

I live by this rule. Reality is nothing; your interpretation is everything. The government is eventually made up of the people who creaed it. If you look back at a YouTube video in which I think is a monologue between an alien and an Earthling take place it explains what a government is. I have thought of planning a new system, poitical and economic, and how we could start a revolution. I have seen this happen many times when people don't agree with the government's decisions, with its, stringent regulations and its extreme legalities over humanitarian efforts, etc. I say we should balance out how much of an optimist and a realist we should be, but not be a pessimist because that would be bad. I am a little more on the perfectionist's side, and I do think we can pursue perfection, but not the actual act of being perfect.

Dark, I maybe wasn't quite clear but I did mean if nothing at all can be done in any form. If convincing one person can be done then I agree we should, but if like you say we're heading for a major crash which can't be averted then we might as well just carry on as normal unless or until that happens. If the crap hits the fan in that regard we'll have to deal with it when it happens but for now we need to keep trying to improve things in our current climate regardless of whether said climate will last or not.

I realize that in the grand skeme of things, I'm merely a grain of sand among many.  So, I'll say my bit, and move on.  I think, ove the years we've made a good deal of progress, and I've been alive for 40 years to see that happen.  When I first started school, I had to fight to be in a mainstream classroom situation.  Now, there are many who take advantage of being in such a situation.  I've never minded paying for something within reason, but, in so doing, I have to balance out whether it is important to me.  I live on my own, I raise my daughter.  Sometimes, at the end of the month, I have almost nothing left.  So, I have to save for quite awhile to get some of these things, and that is assuming my daughter doesn't have things come up that she needs more.  All I'm saying is that sometimes, these companies do charge more than they should forthings and sometimes, it's not a matter of will I pay for an item,...It's can I.  If the answer is no, then it's one more piece of technology that I won't be seeing.  I'm thankful for what I have, and until I can do better, I'll make what I have work.  *warm smile*  I'll thank the developers who put their time and effort into making things accessible for us, and I'll thank the members of this site and others because I learn new and valuable things every day from you all.  Thanks for letting me voice my thought.  Each of you have a wonderful day.

I guess the only things I have against the blind community are their refusal to use anything other then what they think works. for instance, I used an android for a year, when the screen reader was much worse than it is now, and big shocker nfb people, I liked it. I also found it easier in some ways than the iphone. Especially because it didn't randomly play music on me or decide to turn off speech if I wanted to use dictation. I have had to get a replacement iphone because the processor in my other one crashed, and the dictation thing still happens. also the tutorial on androids pretty much blows apple's instruction attempts on the iphone out of the water. I do have 1 issue with the knfb reader, there is text detective, Saytext, and probably countless <$20 apps that are supposed to read stuff you take pictures of for iphones, not counting the droid ones. Many of these are accessible, probably even work just as well as knfb reader. I can understand something like $40 or 50, but how are they "helping blind people be independent" if they are selling things they can't afford.

I know this is an old topic, it showed up in the results of an unrelated search. Probably because NVDA is mentioned in it. Anyway, I just felt that I needed to put in my two cents worth.

I've had vision problems my whole life, for most of my life I had perfectly usable 20/60 vision, but in 2010 I started losing my vision to an very aggressive form of glaucoma and was declared legally blind in July of 2013.

I was fortunate, as part of my benefits package, my last employer included short and long term disability insurance, which pays 60% of your last salary until retirement age when social security takes over. So, between the disability insurance and social security disability benefits, I don't have to work and in fact decided to retire early.

Do I feel entitled? Yes I do, the law says I qualify for the social security benefit income and I earned the disavility insurance benefit by working hard.

Some of my family members complain, I just tell hem that if they want to join me all they have to do is go blind, that usually quiets them down.

This is how I feel about discounts and free things due to a disability. If it's something the law says you are qualified for and should recieve it, if you want it, then by all means, make sure you get it, just don't be rude or obnoxious about it.

If its offered to you, you can accept, but do it graciously with a thank you, don't act like it's your due, because it isn't, the person or company making the offer is just being kind, be kind in return.

With that said, I will say that no matter how much I might want some discount or freebie, I *never* ask for it. I'll let them offer it, if they will.

But, if it's something I need, like help with shopping, or guidance through an airport, I'll ask for assistance, but I do it politely, waiting for my turn at the customer service counter. And while I'm waiting for whom ever will be helping me to arive, I step out of the way so the next person in line can have their turn.

To me it's all just simple common sense. Being rude and obnoxious like the world owes you a favor or that you are entitled, will just make most people resistant to your demands. And just makes you unwelcome. But  if you treat people with respect and consideration, most will be more than happy to do what they can for you.

Am I perfect? No! Not by a very long shot! But I do try.

Now for some specific points brought up in this thread.

I use JAWS because that was all the people at The Lighthouse, where I got my rehabilitation trainning, knew about. I feel rather foolish that I didn't do my own research, had I done so, I might be using NVDA instead.

I have KNFB reader for my iPhone 5s, sometimes I love it because it does a really good job, but other times I wonder why I wasted my money on it when all it returns is gibberish. The gibberish might be from motion blur, though I try to be very still while it is taking the picture it will scan. I've heard that it works a lot better on iPhone 6 and 6+ with their hardware based anti blurring, or is it called picture stability. I waited quite a while before buying it, hoping for a demo or trial version, I eventually gave up waiting, which turned out to be a good decision because there is still no demo or trial version, and at this point, I'd be willing to bet that there never will be.

So, there's my two cents worth, for what its worth.