ah, shame xp mode isn't more display based.

I've run into the word ribbons in 2007, and not found them too bad. yes, I'd prefer menues, but usually I can find stuff with a bit of looking though sometimes it takes hunting.

However, it's the desktop layout, programs shortcuts, favourites and the like that I object to being ribbonized, ----- or buggered as Cx2 would probably say ;d.

Where as in word controls like spellcheck, wordcount, format options etc are only things I need very occasionally, (and that's assuming I can't access them through shortcut keys like ctrl o to open a new file), the desktop and general file management on the pc is something I use pretty much all the time, hence my concern over ribbons there, particularly because as I said, I have organized stuff in specific ways using folders in menues and shortcut keys on the desktop for about the last twelve years, and have thus found a layout I'm very happy with.

I'd be interested to know if classic shell works there.

As regards games, well unfortunately most games seem to be moving over to full mouse or pointer support. As I've said, this is what has completely stopped me from getting a wii, sinse my usual menue counting and navigation methods which I've used sinse the atari days will not work, ----- especially sinse the bloody pointer and background are the same colour, you can't sit close to the tv to use it, and the menue items have an irritating habbit of moving around!

While obviously many games on other consoles have more traditional menues, I've seen quite a few others, dragon age for instance, that use a pointer system ala the mouse, and different ways of organizing buttons.

I don't think it'll be long until all games control interface even if not gameplay, will be driven by a moving pointer, and at that point context sensative menues, screwy controls and alsorts of other fun will start coming in too.

As I've said recently on the audeasy list though, this doesn't particularly bother me anymore.

While there are several beatemups I could play on the xbox or ps3 (or at least play apart from some of the nastier 3D adventure modes), I don't want to buy a new console just for perhaps four or 5 playable games, particularly sinse my favourite genre, low vision accessible 2D platformers like Mega man aren't available on such machines.

If I could work a wii I'd consider getting one for wii ware titles like Mega man 9 or 10, but that's not possible either, and I can't really see that this situation will change in the near future.

As it is I'll stick to my snes, Mega drive and gameboy advanced through the gba player on the gamecube, what games I can find second hand, for my console gaming, and look to indi developers and accessible games for new titles to play on the pc or Iphone if I ever get one.

That soundcard business is hilarious ;D.

Myself, I'm not quite as concerned with what windows 8 may or may not do, in fact I'm rather surprised microsoft are trying to push it onto people when even the upgrade from xp didn't go so well and many people are stil using it.

At my guess, whatever microsoft attempt, most people won't look into another version of windows for a good few years, by which time technology probably will have changed anyway, pluss, I do have enough confidence in the developers at dolphin to at least considder offering support for new in put methods, eg, moving the dolphin curser with a touch pad.

They have done this in the past afterall, indeed I'll freely admit version 4 of Hal was pretty dire on the internet, and it took version 5 and a good few upgrades before that was fixed, ---- which really didn't help dolphin sinse some people got the impression this was Hal's default state.

As to processors, that is however worrying, but as I said I'm not sure we are in a position where we can be certain about any developement microsoft makes whatever they say, ---- look at the managed direct x fiasco, or the "we'll drop support for windows xp by 2010" business (one statement I remember hereing from microsoft a while ago).

I'm not sure about that one aprone, sinse when i phoned nintendo uk and actually asked about the wii menues, if the software was going to be updated with a more traditional arrow control set that I could use, they said not (they were actually very sympathetic, though couldn't actually help sinse all the developedment was done somewhere in japan that even nintendo employees couldn't get access too).

I'm thus not quite as sure as to whether point and click menues are a doomed experiment or not

Besides, there is then the problem which began back in 1994 with the release of the ps1 and has only got worse with time, namely the more 3D games get, the fewer I'm able to play.

Indeed currently, the only modern games I can be certain of are one on one beat em ups, and even in those, the adventure modes are now usually turning into 3D rpgs.

The Wii i would at least have some 2D playable titles, sinse while the majority of actual wii games aren't doable, there are a number of wii ware games which are in older, retro and therefore accessible 2D  style.

portable console devices might be good, as I said the gba and gba player were really a new lease of life for me in the early 2000's, sinse I could get games like metroid, mega man, double dragon advanced, final fight, astro boy and bubble bobble, however with the release of the ds there isn't a way to get the games on a large screen anymore, ---- and the psp's method of tv projection isn't hugely safe or reliable.

thus, whether or not menues are workable seems slightly a moot point at the moment, sinse while back in the Snes days I could play a good 40 or 50 percent of released games and indeed looked forward to new releases like donkey kong country, as soon as things went 3D and spacially over complex that percentage dropped like a stone!

Actually my attempts to play crash bandicoot and mario 64 back when they first came out are some of the most depressing gaming memories I have.

Never mind though, at least people like yourself are stil producing accessible games, and lots of other indi devs are doing retro style stuff, ---- in fact there's a new remake of my ultimately favourite game Turrican in the works just now!

Pluss, as in fact I said in my low vision podcast, indi devs are a lot more reasonable about access changes to games or game engines.

Well aprone, in my assessment of the 3D perspective, I'm afraid I was primarily considdering myself and low vision access, sinse many of the games I play visually would not be accessible without that.

What I have found, is that 2D games (assuming contrast or text issues aren't a problem), are easy to determine with the small amount of visual information I have the identify of my character, landscape features such as ledges and walls, and interactable objects and enemies.

In a 3D game though, the spacial perspective, even when all game objects are visually quite clear, just is too complex for me to cope with, simply because it requires judging of perspective and innumerable other methods, does not use colour as a distinguishing mark, and is not clear in it's spacial relations.

This even goes for first person too.

that's why even though a game like mario 64 (at least on a reasonable console), is bright enough, and well contrasted enough, and even the text would be possible with a faq, when I've tried it i just find myself running up walls, unable to tell which is ledge and which is floor, unable to identify objects correctly etc, even with the bhelp of a faq.

Getting off the low vision discussion though and back to audio games, you are absolutely right about sound being a limited medium.

In audio, you can be very accurate with left and right spacial positioning, and some extra mucking about can show things vertically (imho this is an area where there are stil depths to be explored, sinse many developers simply haven't done as much as I believe to be possible).

however, you can only show a small amount of identifyable sound objects, and only in close proximity to the viewpoint (herepoint?), of the player.

Take a game like packman.

Visually, you can see packman, the entire maze, and all ghosts, dots and power pills at a single glance, and can maintain full status information on where all in game objects are.

audio wise, you have to show things from packman's own perspective, and while you can offer navaids, there is no way to be absolutely and clearly certain of where all objects are constantly.

In the case of packman I personally feel this is an advantage, sinse even though i'm quite able to play visual packman, I actually think it's a far more fun, surprising and challenging game in audio, with far more to explore and far more mental work required on the part of the player.

But this isn't surprising, sinse obviously people stil use audio as a medium of expression in radio precisely because! of this limitation n perspective which allows more imagination, ---- or in the case of an audio game cognitive work, on behalf of the player.

This is however why i believe a tactile display would be such an important tool, sinse it would allow this large assimilation of information, ---- admittedly possibly at a slower wrate.

packman with a tactile display could be virtually the same as visual packman, though probably things would have to move slower.

This is in fact why myself, who (as I've said before), have horribly bad mental mapping skills am able to only play a game like chess or battleships if there is a ful overview representation of the board in front of me, and have had no success at all with audio versions even given the overview involved.

This is I think the main way forward for accessible games, sinse while many games would be beyond it, it could allow a huge amount of access to styles, views and ways of displaying information which thus far have only been visual.