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Of course. They need to wake up. They need to cooperate with other companies. They need to look passed themselves, passed the iPhone, and focus on delighting customers, not their bank accounts.

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@hadi.gsf, "smart" is not the word I'd use to describe something which either gets the music choice utterly wrong, or plays a short sample then demands more money (particularly since we do have an amazon prime subscription already for the free delivery), or more than usually both big_smile.

Frankly I've got my brand new cambridge audio 5.1 speakers attached to my pc, and I'll go on actually, you know owning music and playing through them.

Actually I find the way  the information world has changed from you owning things to wrent or subscription basis rather worrying, from games to music to films, rather than you buy it and its yours, now its so much more often that you need to keep paying for it, and the various companies want to hook people into that model so that they can keep charging, even though from their end the provision of  information costs them nothing to reproduce and barely anything to stream.

That's why if I buy from Amazon music I'll have the mp3 download to play through my uba speakers thank you, and  to use paripheral devices  those unique functions they're suited for and which come with the devices themselves, E.g games and communications on an Iphone, games, trivia and info on the Echo dot etc.

Btw, one rather amusing fact is that these days its actually cheaper to buy new on dvd or cd than what it is to stream, which makes absolutely no! sence at all big_smile.

With our dreaming and singing, Ceaseless and sorrowless we! The glory about us clinging Of the glorious futures we see,
Our souls with high music ringing; O men! It must ever be
That we dwell in our dreaming and singing, A little apart from ye. (Arthur O'Shaughnessy 1873.)

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@dark. pretty true. I would guess that most of this has to do with people getting lazy and lazier. They'd rather have things "On demand" than to spend time collecting and organizing music and movies and whatever content really. and that is there for the taking then. Companies are taking advantage of that and they're making pretty good money out of it too.

Frankly i use  spotify for music discovery and nothing else. But i find it very good at that purpose. I don't own a smart speaker but I do like to play songs and set reminders and check weather by just  going through my room and speaking.

John Petrucci Fan all the time.
twitter: @hadirezae3
skype ID: hadi.gsf7

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For the record, the echo not pulling up enough music on prime music is prime music's fault, not the speaker's. Hook it up to spotify and you're golden... as to the overall idea of streaming and organizing, you can very much still organize everythin the way you used to. I pay $10 for spotify every month and have enough songs that would normally cost upwards of $100 per year, all of which are organized the way I want them. lol. But I see what people mean... there are times when I do appreciate having all the cd's and mp3s that I do have.

Neither Microsoft or Apple can compare to Google or Amazon right now, in terms of smart speakes or their voice assistants. I'm sorry, but Cortana is a joke, and Siri is a joke when it's not being used on an iphone. Apple especially will never leave their sandbox, not when they have their loyal fanbase who will suck up anything they push out. This was why the iphone was as far into the apple ecosystem I would ever get to. I didn't even get it for the brand... I started out on IOS because after the era of symbian smart phones, for the longest time IOS wasthe only thing mainstream and guaranteed to be accessible. Now that I can pick up any Android device and make it work, the paradise is no longer as walled as it was before. Blind people can pick what they want now, but sadly, most will still go with apple.

regards,
assault_freak

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The HomePod will be like the Newton Apple released all those years ago. It will fail. Does anyone here even remember that sorry excuse for a product?

You can't connect the dots looking forward.  You can only connect them looking backwards.

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@Hadi I agree with you about laziness, though it is a shame.
With spottify I was put off by the price, particularly since I doubt very much my university would see it as essential, plus of course as I said I do actually like owning music myself since then I can put it on whatever device I want.

For example, I still have both the cds and the ripped copy of the first ever cd I bought, the final fantasy 7 soundtrack, and that was back in 1996, had I paid a yearly subscription service since then to still have access for it, ---- well you can see how much it'd cost big_smile.
with the more general debate over companies, one thing I will say for the Iphone is that Android still hasn't got there over games, aps, accessibility etc. That was why I bought an Iphonee, despite really! not liking Itunes, and why I bought a new Iphone 8 last christmas.
This to me is  the interesting part about peripherals and other devices, not how they can do the same thing as an existing device, but what they can do that is different or unique to them, and new to the customer and their life style.

For example, up until Ios the only way a blind person could have a satnav was pay for a very expensive custom device, which of course had the magic word "accessibility" on it so cost the earth big_smile.

not anymore.
With Android again I don't have enough experience to comment on the platform, though I will say there hasn't as yet been enough uniquely android things that Android can do which say an Iphone couldn't to make it worth my while investigating, ---- the past issues concerning so many different varients of operating system and the need to configure heavily for accessibility haven't exactly improved the case either.

As to the topic at hand, since I have no interest in Apple music or in Itunes the homepod isn't for me at all.

With our dreaming and singing, Ceaseless and sorrowless we! The glory about us clinging Of the glorious futures we see,
Our souls with high music ringing; O men! It must ever be
That we dwell in our dreaming and singing, A little apart from ye. (Arthur O'Shaughnessy 1873.)

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I stream music sometimes, but my iTunes library is much larger than most people would think.

You can't connect the dots looking forward.  You can only connect them looking backwards.

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Hi.
Multiple things.
At steve, yeah I remember the Nuton, haven't used that on my own though, just heard from people that it wasn't all that good.
@Assault freak, you know, I am still sticking to apple as my phone provider because, from the latest experiences I had with Android, this isn't the system for me.
I have the most problems with the responsivness of talkback, problems while web browsing on the phone, and the general problem of viruses getting to you easier than if you would use an apple device.
I know, there are Viruses and hacking methods for Apple devices, but when you look at the genral market, the hackers, virus developers and so on concentrate on the Android user base.
If there would be an alternative which has the same or a better screen reader than Apple and if the phone has features which would interest me, a change of phone brands would be an option.
Greetings Moritz.

Hömma, willze watt von mir oder wie, weil wenn nich, dann lass dir mal sagen, laber mir kein Kottlett anne Wange und hömma, wo wir gerade dabei sind, dann iss hier hängen im Schacht, sonns klapp ich dir hier die Fingernägel auf links, datt kannze mir mal glaubn.

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The Newton was a complete and total disaster. I don't know what the person who created it was thinking. Wait a minute, yes I do, he wasn't.

You can't connect the dots looking forward.  You can only connect them looking backwards.

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I'm just waiting on Microsoft to hopefully deliver us from our dependence on Apple. The only think a company needs at their core is common sense, really. Microsoft is looking forward, while Apple just sits there and freaking bumps the price of their next iPhone, supposedly of course, to #800 or so. They're just loving using us consumers as test subjects to see just how high they can freaking charge for an iPhone and... Have I said all this here before? Feels like it. Anyways, Microsoft has a long way to go, of course. You can't select text with Narrator and Edge, making the Learning tools, made for accessibility, useless for Narrator users, and the voices we have access to with Narrator suck. Of course, I know they can do better. They have better voices. See Cortana, and even the soundscapes app. Yes, I'm willing to bet that those voices are Microsoft's, and they're freaking teasing us with all that they can do, but all that they aren't quite giving us yet. I know, I'm knit-picking, and I should probably just give up this quest to figure out how to completely optimize what I use and use the best that's out there and just stick to the pirated copy of JAWS that's always out there and Windows and be happy with it, or move back full time to the Mac and just not play games ever again on a computer, but goodness, I know Microsoft can do better. Well, so can Apple but they have shown that they don't give a crap. Sure, the accessibility folks at Apple probably have loads of cool ideas floating around… Or maybe not… but just like Google, its not up to developers, its up to business people. Microsoft doesn't seem to have that problem, and that's why I focus on them, because they /can/ change. They /can/ improve. And I think they will continue to do so, while Apple continues to be the luxury company even though it denies that it is, continues to take huge mouthfuls out of bank accounts, even though they say they're not in it for the money, and push out buggy, incomplete software, iOS and Siri, and boring hardware, like HomePod. Gosh I gotta find something better to do than complain about big companies who don't give a crap about what I say, Lol.

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I just invested a a bunch of money into a Sonos systwem, because it sounds good, can play both local music as well as connect to pretty much every external service, adjust its sound with a little help and can integrate with voice assistants.

Siri is a joke. Siri on the homepod is an even more worse joke because it can't do some of the things it can on the phone. The problem with it is that Apple waisted a massive headstart they had over everyone else by serious mismanagement of all the staff they acquired, so most of them left in frustration. And when they started to expand it, they did it only in a bad, overly controlled way Apple can by making it work only in specific contexts that would prioritise their services (You can call an Uber or Order food with Siri, but there is currently no API to play music from other apps, probably to drive people to Apple Music). In contrast, when Google or even Cortana added app integration they have no such restrictions.

As for which assistant is better, right now Google's better at answering general knowledge questions, while Alexa has more skills over all, for instance when it comes to Home integration. Google wants to add support for 30 new languages just this year and already have a few more that Amazon doesn't. Amazon's hardware is a little more versatile, All echos have a line out jack so you can connect it to a better sounding speaker. You can also connect an Echo do a better speaker over bluetooth. In comparison, only the most expensive Home Max has a line in jack. You can use any of the Google homes  as a Bluetooth speaker but your only option to connect it up to better speakers is using Google Cast over Wi-Fi. This really cripples the Home mini in my opinion because if I want to connect it to something more powerful I would also need to buy a Chrome cast audio, which is another thing I have to spend $30 on and plug into power. This is why I haven't bought either an Echo or Home. Alexa already has Sonos integration, but Google assistant is also coming, and with that the Sonos might also get Google cast support. If it does, I'll buy a Home mini. If it doesn't then I'll probably get an Echo Dot.

As for the homepod... Well you get none of that. Your only 2 audio output possibilities right now are playing from Apple music, or playing audio from an iDevice or Mac over Airplay. Even though the HomePod has Bluetooth, you can't use it for anything, and it has no connectors on it other than the power cable. Meanwhile, Airplay 2, which is supposed to let the Homepod do the stuff everyone else can, like pairing 2 of them in a stereo configuration or setting up multiroom audio, is not out yet and has been delayed for a few months so far. Meanwhile, Sonos will be getting Airplay 2 as well which is one more reason why I think it's such a superior choice to a homepod.

The twins of Mammon quarrelled. Their warring plunged the world into a new darkness, and the beast abhorred the darkness. So it began to move swiftly, and grew more powerful, and went forth and multiplied. And the beasts brought fire and light to the darkness. - from The Book of Mozilla, 15:1

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pitermach that's a great post.
How do you play local music with sonos?
i'm considering to buy a pare of sonos one.

John Petrucci Fan all the time.
twitter: @hadirezae3
skype ID: hadi.gsf7

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Your local music just has to be accessible on your network, IE on a NAS. In my case I just have a hard drive hooked up to a raspberry pi running Samba and have my music and other audio like books on there. Then in the Sonos app you just add any folders you want it to scan (which can also just include folders on your computer although then obviously it'll have to be on for the music to be playable) and it'll go out and index them. Then you can browse and search them either by the usual tags like artist, album, genre, or browse by folder which is great if your music isn't tagged well or you are picky about the way you organise stuff. Then you can set any folder to be played in sequence or shuffled. The Sonos app can also stream any Music from an iPhone or Android.

On that note of buying the Sonos One, I'd absolutely recommend grabbing one if you're looking into getting a voice assistant, but aren't sure which one will work better for you. Because Sonos is an audio company first and formost, the speaker sounds great, and you can use either Alexa or Google Assistant (which is coming this spring) in one speaker and just go back and forth between them.

The twins of Mammon quarrelled. Their warring plunged the world into a new darkness, and the beast abhorred the darkness. So it began to move swiftly, and grew more powerful, and went forth and multiplied. And the beasts brought fire and light to the darkness. - from The Book of Mozilla, 15:1

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Hi.
Yeah, my next big investment audio wise will also be a new sonos setup, I was talking to Ghorthalon in the office yesturday and well, we came to the topic of sonos speaker, my plan is to put two sonos play 5s together as a sterio pair and put a supwoover under the desk to get the base down there, sure, it's expensive, but from what I have heard, it's worth the price, and with 24 month financing, it should be a doable task.
@Pitermach, one question remains for me though, does the play 5 have a headphone jack? I currently have a play 3 and it doesn't, what I want to do is get rid of my big amazon echo and after setting up the sonos system, just plug the echo dot into the sonos system and use alexa over the big speaker, would that be possible?
Greetings Moritz

Hömma, willze watt von mir oder wie, weil wenn nich, dann lass dir mal sagen, laber mir kein Kottlett anne Wange und hömma, wo wir gerade dabei sind, dann iss hier hängen im Schacht, sonns klapp ich dir hier die Fingernägel auf links, datt kannze mir mal glaubn.

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simba wrote:

Hi.
Multiple things.
At steve, yeah I remember the Nuton, haven't used that on my own though, just heard from people that it wasn't all that good.
@Assault freak, you know, I am still sticking to apple as my phone provider because, from the latest experiences I had with Android, this isn't the system for me.
I have the most problems with the responsivness of talkback, problems while web browsing on the phone, and the general problem of viruses getting to you easier than if you would use an apple device.
I know, there are Viruses and hacking methods for Apple devices, but when you look at the genral market, the hackers, virus developers and so on concentrate on the Android user base.
If there would be an alternative which has the same or a better screen reader than Apple and if the phone has features which would interest me, a change of phone brands would be an option.
Greetings Moritz.

When wasyour most experience with Android? I ask only because on the latest software, even on the previous android 7.0, Talkback is far more responsive than Voiceover on my iphone, I can wiz around the screen much faster, and talkback reports changes as fast as my finger moves, as opposed to Voiceover which still has a tiny bit of delay when you start trying to speed things up. Browsing the web is also far better than previous versions of android, though as I don't do much browsing on the web on my phone anyway, I may not be the perfect person to comment on it. But all I'm going to tell you is if you only spent a few minutes playing with Android, of course it's not going to be for you... I'm sick people saying that Android isn't for them because they try it for an hour and then drop it because everything doesn't work the same way as IOS. Viruses and hacking are also something I have never experienced in the year I've been using Android phones, so that argument holds no water, either. My best advice? Find a decent Android phone and not a horrible one, play with it for a good few weeks, and put your iphone down. You may like it or you may not, I'm not here to convince people to switch camps. I simply wish that people would give something a decent chance before ditching something. But I digress..


@61, you may hve just convinced me to go with the sonos 1... at least as one of my speakers. With both assistants, as my central hub this means I can stretch into whichever ecosystem I want, Amazon or Google, or one of each if I so choose... but I'm curious to know when Google Assistant will be coming.

regards,
assault_freak

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Unfortunately I have less experience of this sort of thing  windows 10 refuses to talk to a microphone when I try it so I've not tried either google assistant or cortanna on the pc, and I just have an echo dot because my brother bought one for christmas big_smile.

I like the idea of a voice assistant that can intigrate with your existing music library though, although given I've just spent £1600 on 5.1 cambridge audio speakers I'd rather play directly from my pc at the second big_smile.

With our dreaming and singing, Ceaseless and sorrowless we! The glory about us clinging Of the glorious futures we see,
Our souls with high music ringing; O men! It must ever be
That we dwell in our dreaming and singing, A little apart from ye. (Arthur O'Shaughnessy 1873.)

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@Simba Well isn't that fun, we both got drawn into Sonos by the same person! big_smile
Yes. The play:5 does have a jack at the back. It's one of the reasons I opted to get a play:5, rather than a stereo pair of sonos ones which don't have one. I think Ghorth uses or at least used his play:5 in combination with an echo dot exactly the way you just brought up, so it should work. If the Sonos google integration doesn't include google cast support then I'll probably use it this way as well.

The twins of Mammon quarrelled. Their warring plunged the world into a new darkness, and the beast abhorred the darkness. So it began to move swiftly, and grew more powerful, and went forth and multiplied. And the beasts brought fire and light to the darkness. - from The Book of Mozilla, 15:1

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I unfortunately can't afford a pare of play 5s, i've heard that they sound pretty amazing though.
it's a pity that  the  sonos one doesn't  have an input for a 3.5mm jack

John Petrucci Fan all the time.
twitter: @hadirezae3
skype ID: hadi.gsf7

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@hadi.gsf me neither. Though I found the single play:5 more than satisfactory enough to fill this somewhat large bedroom. It may not have as much stereo separation as my old 2.1 speaker setup that it replaced, but over all it's louder, can fill the room better and has more than enough bass for my needs that I don't really need a sub.
Anyway we're getting way OT for this thread. Might be worth starting a new topic for Sonos if you want to keep this  discussion going.

The twins of Mammon quarrelled. Their warring plunged the world into a new darkness, and the beast abhorred the darkness. So it began to move swiftly, and grew more powerful, and went forth and multiplied. And the beasts brought fire and light to the darkness. - from The Book of Mozilla, 15:1

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Hi.
I used Alexa on the phone, Cortana on the pc, but how can I use google assistant on the pc?

I am your friend, your spam bot reporter, I am what ever do you wan a be to you, but if it is not good, I will not be!
And please, give me a tumbsup, it makes me happy to see one.
Thanks.
Angel Productions, the producer of nothing :)

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Good evening.
@Assault, just to make one thing clear, I am not one of those people dropping something after an hour because it doesn't work or it works differntly compared to a product I used up to this point.
What you suggested is what I actually did. I got myself a cheap Galaxy s7 edge and tested it two weeks, I told myself to put the iPhone away and just use the android phone to do my daily tasks so I could simulate what the phone would need to do in my daily life.
This was like, hmm, let's say about half a year ago. My impression was a lot more positive than some years ago where I didn't have the stamina and patience to get into android fully. but still, there are these fiew things that still bug me and convince me that personally speaking, I am not comfortable to switch to an android device as my main mobile device just yet.
Greetings Moritz.

Hömma, willze watt von mir oder wie, weil wenn nich, dann lass dir mal sagen, laber mir kein Kottlett anne Wange und hömma, wo wir gerade dabei sind, dann iss hier hängen im Schacht, sonns klapp ich dir hier die Fingernägel auf links, datt kannze mir mal glaubn.

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That's fair enough. Like I said, some people will prefer it, some won't. But if I was paranoyed about viruses and hacking, I wouldn't be using windows either. But everyone has levels of risk they're willing to take... I personally love Talkback and how snappy it is. But it all comes to preference and if you did try it for that long, then that's that. Android and IOS and their merits are subjective... I just know that I personally won't switch back unless IOS does something big is done by apple to convince me.

regards,
assault_freak

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I believe the speaker you need is dependent on your music tastes. I don't like loud music, so the Echo dot is perfect for me. Even Bob Dylan sounds decent through that speaker. smile

You can't connect the dots looking forward.  You can only connect them looking backwards.

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I haven’t tried to get the google assistant to work on PC. I use it through the iOS app, which works pretty well. Only thing I had to do )was get a US app store account to get it, as it’s not available in Poland yet.

The twins of Mammon quarrelled. Their warring plunged the world into a new darkness, and the beast abhorred the darkness. So it began to move swiftly, and grew more powerful, and went forth and multiplied. And the beasts brought fire and light to the darkness. - from The Book of Mozilla, 15:1

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Google assistant? What is that? Is that Google's answer to Alexa?

You can't connect the dots looking forward.  You can only connect them looking backwards.

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