26

I realize this is a bit off-topic and will probably lead posts away from the intended track, but as someone who's developing a game in the same genre as redspot (to answer the inevitable question: no, it isn't and will never be a clone)...
What are some things you think that could be done (in general) to limit this sort of situation in the first place. I'm thinking moderator commands, game mechanics, dos and don'ts, anything you can think of that makes games like redspot less fun, or gives an unfair advantage to any person or team. I'm asking this as someone on spectra's team who saw our one-day old base being destroyed by weapons we didn't even know existed before they were used on our base by (at the time) UKA and beta members.
For a little bit of background, the game is a strategic fps (an 'fpss' if you will), will of course be multiplayer, has an account system, and will have moderators and beta members.
A few ideas I've had already include:
* Adding a period of time in which beta members can't log into the stable game, after a new release. This gives non-beta players some time to get used to changes; the period would probably only be like 6 or 12 hours.
* tiered teams. When you first start a team, it might be called a 'partnership' or something similar; your team is at that status until you add more than three members, at which point you move up a tier, maybe to something like a 'group'. Groups might be limited to 5 or 6 players, at which point you move up once more, maybe this time to 'clan' or 'party'. It progresses like this until 'empire' at 20 members or more. So far you might think "fancy names, what's the point?", and that'd be a valid question. My game will have tiered bases as well (outpost, fort, base, fortress, etc). You get the ability to build stronger structures as your team's status upgrades (a partnership can't build a fortress, duh). Maybe people from higher tiers can't attack the structures of people two or more tiers lower than them. So if your a member of an empire, you can't go bumping off partnerships with bases left and right, but you can certainly kick that upstart fiefdom's ass. I feel like this will scale well; if you play casually and are a member of a partnership, you don't have to worry about those asshole empires kicking the shit out of your poor little fort, but you still have competition from groups and other partnerships.

Hit me with ideas while I'm still coding the mechanics; I've already got a client, web backend (leaderboards, character search and display, skills list, search and display, etc), and the server.
Let's use things we've learned from redspot to make a better game.

Regards,
Blademan
Twitter: @bladehunter2213

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27

@26
I am glad to hear about the project that you are working on. I honestly wish you the best in your journey and hope that it doesn't end up anything like where Red spot is headed. smile We definitely need a game without so much drama surrounding it. I'd be glad to help however I can. Would straying this thread off topic really be such a bad thing...

Go to Heaven for the climate, Hell for the company. - Mark Twain

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28

@blademan
I am quite happy to heer about this project. Although I don't like at all this system, fort, base, blah blah blah, but, expect that that everything is better then growning and mowning playerbase and immature devs who hardly care a penny about players users of there products. big_smile
ps: can you say when are beta positions going to be opened? I would very mutch like to see what's this game like.

Alexander Ferrumite
follow me on twitter. @ferrumite666.

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29

at #26: I'd love to contribute to this. It would probably be best done in a separate thread though, if you want to start a thread. You'll get much more attention for it that way.
Thanks,

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30

oh boy... more drama! more amusement.
This is personally why I enjoyed RTR or audioquake much more than I ever did redspot... they didn't try to pretend to be more than they were, which was quick, equal competition PVP, with resets helping to make sure nobody got completely overpowered, or if they did not for long.

"I used to be an adventurer like you, then I took an arrow in the knee."
guards, skyrim

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31

@30
Exactly. No bases, no forts, no stores... Sometimes keeping it simple is the way to go.

Go to Heaven for the climate, Hell for the company. - Mark Twain

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32

@30
Although I haven't liked RTR because of it's tracking system, although I am by now quite shure that it's my laziness big_smile. But yeah. Sometimes keeping it simple is the best way to go

Alexander Ferrumite
follow me on twitter. @ferrumite666.

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33

Rory wrote:

Sam, why do you actively play the game? I know its your game, but developers usually aren't actively playing like you do where your the best player in the game and look down on the other players. Maybe you just like the feeling of power so created redspot to feel like that. But in fps games, developers don't play daily and don't use the their admin powers to their advantage. In games like call of duty, developers may come on every once in a while as a surprise, but they're not usually unbeetable like you are on redspot. And even aprone, when I asked if he could mission with me because I wanted to see how much of a boss he could be with a minigun, admited to me that he's only as good as a player who's been playing for a few weeks. Developers don't play their games. They do to test stuff, but they don't play to the same level you do. Redspot would be much more enjoyable if you and the other admins didn't ban together and become the most powerful team in the game. I mean, personally I think bases and teams should just be removed all together, but you probably aren't going to do that.

Gonna make one point on this matter and it is that I disagree with what you say about Sam shouldn't be playing his own game. It's his game dude, why shouldn't he play it? He's spent time developing it, why shouldn't he get some enjoyment out of that?

Sincerely,
Lucas.

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34

@28: I dislike setting release dates because I feel pressure to keep them, even if things aren't ready. I'd rather tinker with the internals, add more things and release when I'm ready than cram in untested stuff to meet a deadline. I'll put this out there now though: being a beta member will have perks (seeing what's going to be publicly released soon), but it will also have some downsides. Not sure what all of those are yet, but I really want to keep things fair.

@29: I made a topic a few months back asking for item ideas. I got a few, but not as many as I was hoping for. I mainly asked for ideas here because it's a topic that's focused on things that have happened in redspot, and it's these sorts of things which I want to avoid in my game from the start. I most likely won't make a topic until I'm publicly asking for beta testers. While I've been coding for a couple years now, this is my first game so I'm taking things slow.
@31 and 32: It sounds like you guys want a simple "shoot the other guy before he shoots you" sort of game. I like those, but after a while they get boring. I want to make a game that sucks you in; one that you start playing at 3 in the afternoon and stop at 2 in the morning because you have something to do the next day, rinse, repeat.
If someone gives me a good enough reason, I might strip down sv's code (the name of the game is strategy and senseless violence or sasv / sv for short, since it looks like I didn't mention that in my last post) after it's released and just leaving in the combat and basic chat systems for you guys to play around with. With the account system, skills, achievements, structures, channels, and resources left out it's pretty much rtr.
Rtr already exists and is a great game, so unless someone has a convincing reason for me to do all the work it's probably not happening.

Regards,
Blademan
Twitter: @bladehunter2213

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35

Sam_Tupy wrote:

1. This team I have is actually composed of less beta members than you may think. There are many people on this team that I meat by allowing them on the team.
2. The reason the cap never got added is because everyone was talking about it, and we decided not to encourage coward play as in, when everyone is offline, go destroy the base with no defense possible. If I limit a team down to 5 members, the bases would just get destroyed the moment we went offline and everyone's team would last maybe 12 hours.
3. Dude yusterday we were almost destroyed. Playing as the big team or whatever again, I can tell you it is really really hard to get a base above 17 mil health. So we very easily could, get destroyed. If someone was smart, they would go to the sky island and get bitcoins, then get some hp and shields and 20000 throwing stars and come finish us off in 20 minutes.

Aww, Sam doesn't like when his base is destroyed?
How about you get some fucking perspective and realize that you made an fps, not a fucking grindwheel. If you want to grind go to Swamp.
If you can't have no one defending the base for at least 12 hours of course it should be destroyed. Even 30 minutes unguarded should be enough.
Seems like you have some balance issues that you aren't too concerned about addressing.

Team caps would be a great idea because it would require strategy and just not massive numbers.

Maybe bitcoins are a bit too easy to get and if you have a base you can sperg for massive numbers of items?

If you choose to run without a base though you're fucked.

Why am I even writing this though lol, it's not like your deerest dev gives a shit. Just suck it up and move on. It was fun while it lasted.

A read worth reading regarding this very forum:
https://blog.blackscreengaming.com/ag-f … 0/15/2018/

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36

@blademan: balance. You call it a strategy FPS, so I'd expect strategy to have a fighting chance against players who spend all weekend building up their stats and equipment. Obviously, you'd want to reward time and effort, so that people actually put in time and effort, but not so much that it breaks the game for everyone else. This will probably take loads of testing to make reasonably balanced, but yeah, I think balance is the key.

Some of my games
Keep up to date by following @Jeqofire on twitter!
Ear Ninja?

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37

Yeah, i'm for ever done with redspot and sam's crap. Sorry sam, maybe you'll learn from your mistakes, if they can even be called that, when you slowly but surely lose all your god damn players.

I am the blind jedi, I use the force to see. I am the only blind jedi.

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38

Hi.
At blademan urm, I am a bit confused here, what game are we talking about now?
What did I miss here?
Greetings Moritz.

Hömma, willze watt von mir oder wie, weil wenn nich, dann lass dir mal sagen, laber mir kein Kottlett anne Wange und hömma, wo wir gerade dabei sind, dann iss hier hängen im Schacht, sonns klapp ich dir hier die Fingernägel auf links, datt kannze mir mal glaubn.

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39

@36: Exactly. Difficult to do, but lots of fun, I think, if done right. I'd like it to be able to scale well -- for people who want to come on for an hour or so every once in a while to do a little killing it should be fun; same for medium and hardcore players who really put the time in.
As I've mentioned this will be my first game, so I expect growing pains, so to speak.
@38: Read post 26.

Regards,
Blademan
Twitter: @bladehunter2213

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40

Hmm, for me Redspot is a good game. Physics could be improved, though. I love throwing people through the whole map! And, Sam is killable, I managed to kill him once or twice. I like this game if I have to be honest, especially after the new update.

Raduvay se, raduvay
Raduvay se domaki ne
Kolko liste po gorach
Tolko zdrave na taz kyshcha

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41

something witch droo me from redspot was the playerbase that was on the game. Now, I know that that they one night after the update or so they blasted a team, I think that called ttf or something like that, anyway the nembers of that team were causing drama, not on this forum but in the game and now when they have stopped playing everything is as it was earlier. Still I would wish if he would add a cap at leest to the bases health, it doesn't need to be say 1000000 but it can be, say 10000000 so that we don't have any more bases with over 100000000 health. Also, the players health and the shielded shots cap should be added to. Team cap wouldn't make the problem better, because then, say if you have loads of friends and the all want to play and stuf. All in all only thing that this game makes it self as a bad game is it's playerbase and partly the developers actions. And, who said that Sam was inpossible to kill. More over, I am quite shure that I have seen sam dy more times then anyone else big_smile.

Alexander Ferrumite
follow me on twitter. @ferrumite666.

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42

ahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha,  now i can bac and playing rs normal withe out uka dying and killing me , hahaha

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43

@connor:
Developing for the community? Nah. Please cut that crap anymore. Please. Develop for yourself. If you're doing this for the community, don't. You will get no taste out of it, even if you develop for the best community of the world. Because you are not developing for people you know or yourself, you're developing for bunch of people who you don't know.

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44

I've stoped playing all Sam's games, this is my only comment I'll throw on this matter. Blademan, good luck in your project. But if it'll be (as usual) managed by kids and teenagers, excuse me, from now I tell you, I won't play it. I'm not looking down younger folks, but you all know what kids' management will end up with.

Regards
Add me on skype
Follow me on twitter
Our blind community is unfairly treated, when it comes to games.

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45 (edited by TheGreatCarver 2018-07-18 19:25:37)

Okay, I read this topic, and thought, "Ah, I'll just let it go away; we've seen lots of these topics before." Well, no more. I've had it.

I've had it with this pointless bickering. I've had it with someone putting what should be a private discussion between two people on a public forum. And most importantly, I've absolutely had enough of this ridiculous myriad of childishness and drama revolving around Redspot!

sorressean, posting this topic was the worst thing you could have done for this situation. You have been active on this forum for at least a month, so you have definitely seen the all out wars topics of this sort can cause. Why, then, have you posted this topic, knowing that whatever comes of it can almost never be good? Why couldn't you have worked this out with Sam_Tupy in private, exhausting all forms of private reconciliation before starting this train wreck?

Sam_Tupy, you responding to this topic only fans the flames. You trying to defend this situation is about as idiotic as asking the cat that ate the canary why the bird cage is empty! Your motives for this situation are as clear as day. You wanted full control, so you formed a new team that would do a Cha-Cha while spinning around in circles while also solving the mystery of life itself, all on your command! You wanted to have free reign on your own game at the detriment to the wrest of the player base.

Now, I'm done. Do what you will; I've put my opinion out there for you to do whatever with. Have a nice day to you all, and please, for the love of all things Elvis, stop this nonsense!

The Beast adopted new raiment and studied the ways of Time and Space and Light and the Flow of energy through the Universe. From its studies, the Beast fashioned new structures from oxidised metal and proclaimed their glories. And the Beast’s followers rejoiced, finding renewed purpose in these teachings.
from The Book of Mozilla, 11:14

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46

TheGreatCarver wrote:

Why, then, have you posted this topic, knowing that whatever comes of it can never be good?

I wouldn't say it can never be good...

"I used to be an adventurer like you, then I took an arrow in the knee."
guards, skyrim

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47

A little late weighing in, but I wll say this. any fps games that bases itself off of player accounts, stats and equipment that continue in realtime is going to end up a horrible mess. Call of Duty and other modern mainstream games do not keep stats and equipment... the only thing they follow is your player ranking, which ahs no impact on gameplay. There are no structures that last between session, and there is no such thing as a central game... everyone starts their own game and people join it, whether they know you or not. Thus, two groups of players can play using the same map, without ever actually coexisting. Want to avoid drama? That is the way to do it... the combination of a central game world where people can do stuff to your bases and things even when you are not online, combined with the immaturity ripe in that game's community is what will cause the drama. Just my two sense... it isn't rocket science!

regards,
assault_freak

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48

@TheGreatCarver
This forum exists for people to post opinions and chat. @sorressean had every right to come forward and talk about his opinions for my game. Just as I have the right to compose a response. It is called having a conversation. The flamewars that pop up are disconcerting to say the least, but it cannot always be blamed on the poster of the topic. It's like blaming a couple for having a baby because that baby was going to cry and make it hard to sleep.
And also remember that when we read text... text's expression capability goes as far as exclamation and question marks. Text in it's self is almost completely hollow, and it is often times up to the reader of such text to assimilate it and decide what it means. Text is descriptive and conversational, but it is sadly not very expressive. Thus, from just reading forum posts, we don't know what is anger, or what is a civil discussion. If people have an issue with a product, posting about it is the only way that product can change. Not to mention the fact that you just responded saying that responding was a bad, and utterly idiotic idea.
There is an expression called, listen to every side of a story before judging. You telling me it was idiotic to respond because you perfectly know my motives is rather uncalled for. If we're giving blunt opinions here, mine is that posts such as that, saying in round about ways that we are idiots for having a conversation are the kinds of posts that lead the conversation onto the path of blazing flames.

I am a web designer, and a game developer. If you wish see me at http://www.samtupy.com

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49

#45:
First, why do you think you need to tell us you're speaking? Do you think your words specifically hold weight? I am in complete agreement with sam, sans the really weird analogy. I'm afraid he'll never outgrow those, it's sort of like if a banana and a dog were friends, you can't blame the apple now can you? But moving on; nothing I've said here is out of anger. I really do want to see sam and Redspot do better and thus I post them here; my private conversations don't really lead anywhere. You thus far are the only person who has indulged in name calling. If you're tired of seeing posts, sipmly don't read the threads. There are plenty more threads open for your vast and weighty opinions to land. Sam's motives aren't really clear to me beyond that he just doesn't want to change, but there is nothing wrong at all with him defending himself. there similarly is nothing wrong with me posting my opinion and sam and I have had discussion without "fanning the flames," as you call it. So you playing moderator and parent really was the worst thing for this thread.

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50

@tgc
I don't think that telling someone that he shouldn't have posted the topic because someone decided to use bad language and stuf is the right way to go. I have said a milion times that these kind of topics are allowed. And, if you just wanted to make this topic to get off the first page, then stop replying to it would be the best way to go.
@44So you would exclude all yung developers just because some of them are just immature like Sam? I meen, that's not the age that matters, it's the maturety of the developer witch matters.
and, rt post 43. if you are going to develop for all other 6999999999 people then you can freely stop developing at all. Do something witch will make you happy, not something witch will make other people happy.

Alexander Ferrumite
follow me on twitter. @ferrumite666.

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