2016-05-13 14:13:24

As promised an update on #SteamGate - the recent conversation on whether or not Steam-games should be added to the AudioGames.net database (and the discussions here and on social media that followed). There have been a few conversations amongst the admins and founders and moderators of the site, leading to the agreement of adding sound-based games such as SkullGirls that are distributed via digital VI-inaccessible distribution channels such as Steam (but are playable without Steam once purchased and installed).

It does not happen often that an issue such as this arises in the audio games community and we're happy it was solved pretty fast without a lot of damage. We do want to stress that AudioGames.net is fueled by spare time and an immense love and passion for audio games. All of us at AudioGames.net have worked really hard to build up this community, keep it spam-free and update the database with games that are ready to play.
Please remember, especially in the heat of an online discussion, that there are no big companies behind AudioGames.net, and that, as such, it is solely run by enthusiasts who all share the notion that audio games are important. Because they are. Their importance and meaning is proven every single day by the approximately 4000 of silent spectators and active participants that visit the database and forum to connect and share their ideas and experiences.

The past 14 years have proven that the audio game community is awesome. Truly. Our community is positive, vibrant, creative, respectful and most importantly: fun! And we are grateful and proud to be a part of it for the past 14 years. Which, in Internet-time, is a pretty long time (in perspective, AudioGames.net is older than Twitter, Facebook and WhatsApp). The recent conversation on the definition, scope and identity of audio games and AudioGames.net might be one that was overdue but perhaps relevant in order to make the next 14 years even more wonderful. It is a fact that new platforms and technologies for audio games will and have already come into existence. And we might want to get ready to support drone audio games, VR audio games, self-driving car audio games and heck, even super cochlear implant audio games?

Maybe the time to re-evaluate the possibilities and new potentials of future audio games is... now.

Are you in for a ride?

Richard and Sander

2016-05-13 14:27:06

Hello
thanks for the information
I believe that it is the best decision.
best regards.

sorry my english, is not my native language.

2016-05-13 21:32:26

Richard and Sander, Thank you for your efforts in this matter, surely a small detail next to your busy lives. It gladdens me to know that you're both forward thinking administrators who want the community to be able to evolve as new platforms and types of games arise.

And let me be not remiss. Thank you to the moderators who do their job voluntarily.

Kai

Spill chuck you spots!

2016-05-14 15:22:00

I'm very disappointed that so many visually impaired people are saying that it OK for Valve to show its intolerance of and lack of consideration for the visually impaired by refusing to make Steam accessible despite repeated attempts to inform then of the interest the visually impaired community has in it.

If it's typical to forgive a company's refusal to make their products accessible because there's a work around. Then you really have no room to complain when a product is inaccessible.

Go create a work around!

2016-05-14 18:11:26 (edited by guilevi 2016-05-14 18:11:52)

@Figment, please don't take this as an offense. I am not trying to start a flame war or anything remotely similar. Nobody said we agree with what Valve is doing. Nobody said it was OK for Valve to ignore our requests. But this is not about Valve. We are not advertising the platform, but the games within, which have nothing to do with Valve except for the publishing part. Please do take this into consideration and think about the independant developers that actually devote their time to making these games fully playable.

Thanks.

A fight we cannot lose.
An enemy we cannot defeat.
A destiny we cannot escape.
Follow me on twitter @guilevi2000

2016-05-14 18:12:25

hello. You have to take into considoration that this is not about valve. This is so much bigger than one gaming company. Just because a few of them haven't shown any interest, doesn't mean that all of them will be that way. Look at SG. It's a start, and everything has to start somewhere, so this is as good of a start as any other in my opinion.

I live in darkness, forever in darkness.

2016-05-14 18:20:28 (edited by arjan 2016-05-14 18:22:31)

@figment, I'm sure all of us would love to hear a good alternative that also enables people to play the games. Correct me if I'm wrong, but so far most people who dislike tolerance for accessible steam-based games have themselves done nothing to increase the chance that steam will become more accessible. As an example, Some people have said in the past that we as a community should take a more agressive stance with valve, claiming that valve's continuous refusal to make steam more accessible infringes their basic human rights. But so far none of those people have actually done anything which causes improvement. So my opinion is that if they're going to talk the talk, they should also walk the walk. So I urge anyone complaining about this change to AudioGames.net to think for a moment about what they would do instead. At least we are doing something. Whether that is the best option, I don't know. But it's still better than doing nothing.

2016-05-14 23:47:52

@figment: I'm seriously hoping that things might start to change and perhaps listing some games might be a start, as we can gather solid evidence that developers are taking time to add screen reader support to their games and give links to the actual pages too, the site entries, etc. Granted though, most of the site entries are just going to be updates to existing pages the only new one right now would be Skullgirls. Remember that Valve themselves are not the developers of these games, and that is the difference and an annoying one, but the games listed will be usable with screen readers once Steam is launched and running in the background. I'll give another example, a bit different, yes, but similar too.

This website has a game called Demor, and also another one called IN The Pit. Well back when these games were added, they had a massive distinction which set them apart. They needed a game controller to play, no keyboard support. I literally couldn't play them for years, but then somehow one day I ended up getting a game controller. Luckily, the games were still listed, and because the way was paved for the future, it was a matter of grabbing the games and plugging in the controller, and I wasn't locked out anymore.

While Valve are important, yes, it's not just about Valve here. The dev of Skullgirls, the devs from Choice of Games gamebooks, and the devs who made Grail to The Thief, could have all turned round and told us, hay, we're not going to add accessibility features to our games because Steam isn't accessible. Instead, they gave people who wanted to experiment, a chance to actually try it, and implemented features into their games. With new lores coming into play as well, and a small list of games that support screen readers, I think it's about paving the way for the future, Valve still won't listen overnight. However, imagine what will happen if in a year or two they launch something self voicing the way Microsoft and Sony did, and everyone's going to be looking for games to play. We'll be ready for them. The thing is, it's going to be a small list the only pages I can see changing are, a new one for Skullgirls, an update to the Choice of Games page, an update to the Grail to The Thief page and an update for A Blind Legend. We're not about to start adding random games to the db, absolutely not. Our mission has not changed. But if enough people are made aware then maybe, just maybe, we can actually to start to make a slow difference and maybe even get some sighted folks on our side, and those folks might be able to contact people in the gaming industry and get Valve to finally listen. It's perhaps chasing a dream, yes, but sometimes dreaming big can work, I mean look at the xbox one and ps4 now, they're talking games consoles. I never thought that would happen. So who knows where this could lead. It might not lead anywhere, but isn't it worth a chance to take a different approach?

2016-05-15 01:33:01

Hi everyone,

Thanks for your replies. If you're interested, have a look at the following article published a couple of days ago on Gamespot:

http://www.gamespot.com/articles/consol … 0-6439754/

The game industry, like many other industries, is most likely going to evolve into a service industry. That means in the (very near) future you will not be purchasing copies of games (which you now own) anymore, but that you will be paying a (monthly) subscription for (a month of) gameplay (and will not own any game anymore. Similar to Netflix or Spotify. Goodbye information age, hello experience age. You could focus on Steam now but maybe it is wise to browse the horizon for these future services and whenever one pops up, challenge their accessibility immediately. Hopefully we can stimulate accessibility into a unique selling point amongst such services.

Concerning Steam: I had another look at the change.org campaign to make Steam accessible for blind gamers and I think we should have another go at that. A campaign I mean. We may also have some people in our personal network in the industry who might want to help contacting Gabe directly.

2016-05-15 01:42:50

Hello
I coincide with richard.
We should do a campaign in change.org, or to look supported in the same steam forums.
But if we remain seated without doing anything, steam it will never change.
greetings and thanks.

sorry my english, is not my native language.

2016-05-15 02:59:23

Who would ever pay a monthly fee to play games?  Oh wait... forget I said anything!  This is a wonderful idea!  big_smile

- Aprone
Please try out my games and programs:
Aprone's software

2016-05-15 14:45:21

Hi all,
@Richard, I can reopen the petition again, if you feel that we can go further. It is a shared opinion between me and a couple other people is that our campaign failed partly due to failed press coverage. We had hoped to be covered by major gaming magazines, however this did not happen, thus unfortunately we were unable to raise such a level of awareness which would've lead us to possible accessibility improvements in the Steam client itself.

Rob

----------
Robjoy, AKA Erion
Visit my site for all the things I do and to contact me.
You can also stop by for a slice of Pi

2016-05-17 01:21:08

Hello all and I think that adding games from the Steam thing is good if they are accessible. I had heard that some of the gamebooks from Choice were there, but I've never used the Steam thing. What do you do? Just go there, get your game and download it to your computer? Can you play the game once on your computer without running the Steam thing or is this like a game engine so you have to run it like the older Inform TXT games from interactive fiction archive.

2016-05-17 01:42:30

Hi there Rob, I can try and help out as well, I do chat a lot with the twitch streamers I follow, and they are all willing to help out. I even got them all to sign the petition, when it was running. I'm sure they don't mind helping out again. I can even try to get in touch with the fighting game community, and see if they will post an article for it on the shoryukin.com site.

You can add me on Steam.
Here is my Twitch profile page Follow me if you want.
You can also follow me on Twitter.
Kong!

2016-05-17 15:25:27

@Deng

Steam is a game client that you use to purchase and download games through. It is also a DRM system for the purchased games so it must be running for your games purchased through Steam to run.

The problem is that while there may be some accessible games on the Steam platform, the Steam client is known to have accessibility issues that Valve Software refuses to correct.

2016-05-18 02:21:52

@Figment: I know what steam is. In my signature, it clearly shows that I use steam. I was just suggesting that I can get the word of the petition out to sited people who would have more leverage, and are willing to help us fight to make steam more accessible, like the fighting game community.

You can add me on Steam.
Here is my Twitch profile page Follow me if you want.
You can also follow me on Twitter.
Kong!

2016-05-18 02:53:59

Figment: Lets call a spade a spade. No where has Valve declared its unwillingness to modify the Steam client to comply with accessibility guidelines, so I'll take issue with your declaration that the company is refusing to accommodate. It may not be a top priority update, it may not be part of its current plans, and we may not even see it for a while, but there are no statements that I know of where they outright refuse to try and conform to accessibility standards. Lets take Sony and Microsoft as examples. We never expected accessibility features for their console platforms, and yet they appeared. The same could happen with Steam in the future.

Valve's lack of response to the change.org petition does not constitute a statement of refusal -- I'm sure that many, many other change.org petitions go unanswered. You can't honestly think that just because it's on change.org, people will automatically respond to or abide by it. Can you imagine the chaos if such were the case? Government to replace politicians with the currently popular celebrities in response to a change.org petition. Someone help the world.

Do I agree with Valve's dismissal of the petition? Of course not. Do I wish we would've gotten some response? Absolutely. However, we can't know that the response hasn't happened behind doors, and that a change might be in the works. Conversely, we can't know that Valve even gave the petition due process, being that it pertains to a small market footprint.

Things being what they are, Steam is still perfectly useable, if you but take the time to make a few tweaks which require no system changes or jumping through hoops -- all the changes are made to the client, or to the shortcut which launches the client.

Kai

Spill chuck you spots!

2016-05-18 13:40:00

LOL @ aprone - Given you write such things, thats funny, its cool tho, so do I wink

2016-05-18 15:21:44

Hello everyone,

Richart: Thank you for the positive decision. I'm fighting for the game accessibility everyday and it's not really a easy task. I did a lot regarding Skullgirls and there's more to come in the future.

Regarding steam, I know one person who knows someone from the team behind this platform. I'll try to get in touch with this person so MAYBE Steam will be more accessible in the future. Also, I think restarting steam accessibility petition will be really a good decision.

Twitter
Add me on Steam
Discord: lirintheblindguy
BattleTAG: Lirin#21759

2016-05-21 04:34:25

Hi,

I thought I should share some information that might be useful to this conversation.

In the United States, we have a law called the 21st Century Communications and Video Accessibility Act (CVAA). My understanding is that it actually covers things like video games, gaming consoles, and distribution.  You will sometimes see this law referred to as CVAA.

Yesterday marked Global Accessibility Awareness Day and one of the events that went on was something called ID24 (Inclusive Design 24.)  Basically, it consisted of 24 1-hour presentations on accessibility topics.  Three of the presentations focused on accessibility of gaming.  One talked about accessibility features being added to XBox-1.  Another presentation covered some accessibility work done on Uncharted 4.  The last was a presentation about the general topic of the accessibility of gaming.  One of the comments is that accessibility of video games is still in its early stages, but it is improving.

There are also evidently some groups like Able Gamers that have done some work with various companies in the video gaming market and they have evidently made some progress.

What we might really need to do is try to develop some connections with Valve--either working through a group like Able Gamers which probably already has some connections in the gaming market or find others with connections to Valve that might be able to talk with them about the issue.

If you think about the success we have seen with Skull Girls, that is because someone from our ommunity managed to make a good connection with a developer for the game. This provided us with an opportunity to engage in a dialog that has made this work out. We probably need to try to duplicate the same thing with Valve if we want to improve the accessibility of Steam.

I suspect with CVAA either Valve is or will be improving the accessibility of Steam. But one of the most difficult parts of making any application accessible is trying to figure out what you need to do that might help the users. If we make those connections, we can provide them with feedback on such things as what parts of Steam might need to be fixed first and what things give us the most trouble.