51

I'm not sure, but running NVDA with addons is a much more enjoyable experience. Here are just some of the things i currently can do: Press NVDA}alt}d to hear dropbox status, translate text from a language to another language with a shortcut, check ram and CPU usage with a shortcut, and so on. About having features you want, that's exactly what NVDA is aiming for. Just loo at the size of the OCR addon and compare it to other addons, and you would see that if it was added in NVDA it would increase it's size by 80 megabites and that's just one feature. The only reason it's included in win 10 is cause OCR pacgages are built in. In fact, even jaws doesn't have them by default, and the installer downloads OCR when it's installing jaws.

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52

Rory wrote:

I imagine freedom scientific would update all that as windows improved, wouldn't they? Honestly i'm still using jaws 12 at home so wouldn't really know heh

They've already had to change things when it comes to Edge support, so it wouldn't surprise me. If they want JAWS to remain a viable product, things will have to change when Windows changes.

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53

the only reason I use NVDA is for rtr. other than that I have no use for it and will never change to it full time or anything. especially since web browsing is so much better with jaws. and lol at someone crying about not being able to change the inflection. it's funny that you won't use jaws for that reason. I really think the problem is people always want shit for free, and since jaws is a bit pricy everyone just decides to bash the fuck out of it for no good reason. I've been using jaws for 20 years and if rtr supported jaws that shit wouldn't even be on my pc at all. I have no use for it outside of 2 audiogames.

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54

also jaws's speech history thing kicks the ass of clip copy for sure.

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55

Accessibility is a human right, therefore politically-speaking, it should be free. You should only have to pay for something if it is an expensive luxury or accessory item. And I'm sure someone could develop a speech history with NVDA's open source. Somoene could argue and say that iOS is locked, just like JAWS is locked. Android and Linux are open, so they can be tinkered with, same as NVDA.

Ulysses
AKA Green_Gables_fan and HeavenlyHarmony
My new, self-hosted version of WordPress!

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56

@JimmyDub There is absolutely no reason for you to write something is a shit. Don't like it, don't use it.
To everyone else: Clip copy actually got an awesome update, and if you get it from the official addons site which is where you should get addons from anyways, you can use shift+f11 and shift+f12 to read the history, and then f12 to copy the selected item.

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57

When you have to pay the price of two computers to use one, "a little prisy" is quite the understatement.
Is Jaws better on web browsing in general, or is it just IE/EDGE? Real question.

Some of my games
Keep up to date by following @Jeqofire on twitter!
Ear Ninja?

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58

Whoa! This thread has turned into a full blown JAWS versus NVDA flame war.

While I agree with Jimmy Dub that I will never give up JAWS, I strongly don't agree with his assessment of NVDA.

Jimmy is doing the one thing that annoys me the most about NVDA users, it seems that they go out of their way to bash JAWS instead of accepting that everyone is different and has the right to make a choice without other people making disparaging remarks about it.

For what it is and what it costs, NVDA is an amazing product. I have it installed for those few situations where JAWS is a problem, but have decided that it is not for me as my primary screen reader.

All I ask is that the choice I have made for myself be respected, just as I respect your choice of NVDA.

Is that too much to ask?

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59

Yes, Orko, it is too much to ask and too difficult. How dare you ask me to respect your choice! I will not do it! big_smile

And thus the beast grew powerful, and fire and thunder swept the land. But Mammon stirred in their hearts, and the beast Foundered, and its Corpse arose, and commanded "thou shalt not fly in my name." And the blazes shall freeze cold, and the souls of the followers of Mammon shall learn to tremble in the
face of ice as they did before the fire.
from The Book of Ice, 10:13

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60 (edited by Chris 2017-09-11 01:47:22)

Freedom Scientific is using a business model that's over 20 years old. Times are changing. I've said this and I'll say it again. The only valid reason I can think of to use JAWS is either because that's what you're used to or you're using custom scripts for inaccessible applications in a work environment. The default NVDA installation works very well for 99% of the average daily tasks anyone would want to do in Windows. You do not need to install add-ons unless you want optional features.

Grab my Adventure at C: stages Right here.

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61

Say whatever you like, I don't care, because after this message, I'm just going to ignore this thread.

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62

Thumbs up Chris!

Ulysses
AKA Green_Gables_fan and HeavenlyHarmony
My new, self-hosted version of WordPress!

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63

hi all, guys. I had decided it's time for me to write here. About jaws, never loved it. When in my 7 years when i just started it was royal pain for my old computer to handle it. Lags, all that. And finally i broke it. I had never managed to break nvda, so. I will always respect nvda better than jaws. All my friends are using NVDA, cause i gave them proofs, so jaws is хуже than nvda. Jaws has it's own pros and cons, while nvda has it's pros and cons. Oh, yeah. I guess FS just invented a new interface with ins+f11 to just increase there popularity, to show themselves from the good side. Someone said you need to install addons, to add features like in jaws. Well, you see. I guess main nvda's task is customization. Don't like something, poof! and it's gon. Isn't this good? Don't know to say anything more, so sleepy. it's 4 am on here.

Ch-games, our company.
http://ch-games.ru/en/
If you want to cry, cry then. Don't think about anythink. We all can cry...

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64 (edited by dongargon 2017-09-11 01:56:50)

@orko.
Which NVDA users do you know bashes JAWS as 'a piece of shit that's on their computer'? I certainly don't have JAWS anymore, having ditched it for NVDA for several reasons, but I can't discredit the value of JAWS in the screen reader market. I can bash JAWS as much as I please, however, as much as persons can bash NVDA's web support and speech history. I won't do so here, now, but to each his own in my view. NVDA suits my needs and is only getting better. Oh, and did you know it's free! Yes, free, so that's a big plus in my book. My book, my rules.

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65

Such comments do pop up from time to time, even on this forum. Then there are the mocking names ("Flaws" "Freedom ScienceFiction", etc). It's just like Apple vs Google, or Mac vs PC, or subs vs dubs, etc. Every nice thing has not-so-nice fans who delight in rudeness and insult of the competition.

Humans are weird.

Some of my games
Keep up to date by following @Jeqofire on twitter!
Ear Ninja?

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66

Jaws has speech history? How do I use that? I had to use NVDA's clip copy thing until i updated it and litteraly all my add ons got deleted, yet another reason I will never switch over completely.

I am the blind jedi, I use the force to see. I am the only blind jedi.

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67

Updating NVDA really shouldn't remove add-ons. That's quite strange. Also, if you search on the add-ons site, you will find Speech History add-on.
I'm not too sure about the JAWS equivalent though, but knowing how NVDA is open to suggestions on a priority level, a more intuitive speech history feature than the Speech Viewer currently in the program may materialise.

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68

The problem with JAWS, as I see it, is that there's too many features crammed in with it that are not necessary. While the argument can be made that the average person wants the comfort of having a lot of features already at their disposal, so that they barely have to think about where those features are located or why they're there, I would say that in today's increasingly hostile cyberworld, one needs to think critically about why they need things, what those things do, and how to get them in a trustworthy manner. This is what NVDA provides. A sense of independence, where a person can say, "ah, I would like to OCR documents, translate text, check the weather, etc." And so they have to venture out and find those add-ons themselves. While it's true that there are some untrustworthy add-ons out there, they're very few and far between. And, besides, living and learning is how one gets better at discerning good and bad information, programs, and so on. When you've got a screen reader holding your hand and not encouraging you to venture outside its protective walls, as I feel JAWS does with mandatory features such as Research It, not very many people will actually see what else is out there. This is especially true for those who are just learning to use computers, such as children, who will take any shortcut they can, and once any habit is cemented, it's nearly impossible to break. What NVDA does is makes it possible for people to make more informed computing decisions by necessity. That will never be a bad thing in my book. If a person has a developmental or learning disability, and needs more structure, then I think JAWS has its place. JAWS also has its place in the job market, as its scripting language is still more powerful in ways that NVDA might not ever be due to the limitations of acceptance of open source software in the workplace in general. But I would personally never go back to it, unless a job required its use. I like being able to cherry pick which features I want. Oh, sure, NVDA comes with a core which we can't change, unless we know Python and want to completely change its functionality. But I personally find it empowering to be able to say "hey, I don't actually want to be able to use insert f11 to open the system tray." Or to be able to press one keystroke to get an accurate, clear picture of the weather for the next 7 days. Also, there are people in developing countries who appreciate this project far more deeply than the average person can ever begin to understand.

The glass is neither half empty nor half full. It's just holding half the amount it can potentially hold.

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69

Hello,
To activate Speech History in JAWS, you press insert+Space, followed by H.

JAWS is a significantly professional screen reader, whether you are in an educational, work, or business environment. It has quite a lot of features that are meant to suit the needs of all users, and not a few who may need some, or many features built into the screen reader. It is fairly customisable as you can customise how JAWS reads and displays the information, how you want to work with the information and how you want to change the information you are working on. Particularly, I find JAWS a very professional program in an educational environment where I am everyday. It is very well integrated with Microsoft Word, Excel, Powerpoint and outlook. I like the customisation you can make on JAWS, for instance; you can make JAWS read in another voice, or in a deep voice text that is italicised, bold, underlined or bullitted. For each of the above features you can customise JAWS to speak in a particular voice or pitch. Also, you can yourself create a so-called scheme or reading scheme that suits your needs in reading and hearing information. For example, you can create a scheme where JAWS reads bold, italicised or underlined text in a deep voice, play a sound when a misspelled word is encountered, and report the colour or style of text in another voice. You can customise it the way you like so as to help you get more information on the document or webpage you're working on, and work more efficiently with your documents.
I don't know how many of you are at university, where you need to be very precise about the things you read, things you write, things you say, and things you learn. I have never found myself comfortable working with NVDA in what I mentioned above, (in an educational environment). JAWS has helped me a lot in reading and writing. For example, our professors give me lectures in electronic formats, and they highlight the information that is essential to remember. They always italicise it and when JAWS encounters the text, the voice changes to a deep one, just as it was reading a dialog box, or a notification. But it's not only this. JAWS reports more information on a document, for example, the line where the cursor is focused, or you can read the statistics of the document by pressing insert+shift+N and it will tell you how many pages does the document consist of, the language of the text, whether it has spelling errors, comments, and also the layout of the document, that is, print layout, reading layout, outline, or web layout.
Finally, I have to rightfully mention that I am not a JAWS fanboy. I have tried several times to switch to NVDA, even managed to stay a full week with NVDA, but there are some things that NVDA doesn't have, that are not fulfilled either by the basic package, or by the package with Add-ons.

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70

Hi.
Having been in the university environment, I can say that NVDA, although not professional, helped me a lot. Yes, I miss hearing font attributes with a different voice, but I think that's it. NVDA can read the status line of a Word document so I can know page numbers and word count, it can give me font attributes (with the same voice as reading though), and a neat feature since recently is indicating spelling errors via sound, right after it's typed. I can move to spelling errors in Word's browse mode. I can read font attributes and format my own documents. Don't want to turn on these features by default? I can create a configuration profile!

I think part of the reason I prefer NVDA is the ease in customisation. JAWS, despite providing tutor messages, makes setting it up a bit difficult. Yes, there is excellent documentation, but to jump, skip, hop and jump again just to turn off list reporting in a web page, that's not cool for a new user. Where a screen reader is concerned, easily setting it up plays a huge role for me, and NVDA gives me that ease in customisation.

I'm a big fan of NVDA, but, as I have clearly shown, I respect JAWS. It has its merits. If a friend of mine uses JAWS, no problem. If someone asks me, which screen reader do you recommend I use, I'll tell them NVDA, not because it's the best for them, but because it's the best for me.

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71

Big thumbs up to that last post before mine! :-)

Ulysses
AKA Green_Gables_fan and HeavenlyHarmony
My new, self-hosted version of WordPress!

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72

CAE_Jones wrote:

When you have to pay the price of two computers to use one, "a little prisy" is quite the understatement.
Is Jaws better on web browsing in general, or is it just IE/EDGE? Real question.

it's better with web browsing all together. also it can handle certain software better than NVDA can. for example Spotify. balls to having to possibly use an addon for something I can use with jaws as soon as it is installed. when NVDA can do web browsing as good as jaws does I'll consider changing my mind about this, but until then. NVDA can go straight to hell.

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Rory wrote:

Jaws has speech history? How do I use that? I had to use NVDA's clip copy thing until i updated it and litteraly all my add ons got deleted, yet another reason I will never switch over completely.

insert space and h. it will bring up all your history and then just go to what you want to copy and go from there.

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74

SkyLord wrote:

hi all, guys. I had decided it's time for me to write here. About jaws, never loved it. When in my 7 years when i just started it was royal pain for my old computer to handle it. Lags, all that. And finally i broke it. I had never managed to break nvda, so. I will always respect nvda better than jaws. All my friends are using NVDA, cause i gave them proofs, so jaws is хуже than nvda. Jaws has it's own pros and cons, while nvda has it's pros and cons. Oh, yeah. I guess FS just invented a new interface with ins+f11 to just increase there popularity, to show themselves from the good side. Someone said you need to install addons, to add features like in jaws. Well, you see. I guess main nvda's task is customization. Don't like something, poof! and it's gon. Isn't this good? Don't know to say anything more, so sleepy. it's 4 am on here.

well when there is an addon to say poof. it's gone to NVDA's shitty way of web browsing please let me know.

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75

Might I ask what exactly is wrong with the way how NVDA deals with the web? I mean, I clearly see that you don't intend to use the program, but at least provide some use cases and examples, rather than throwing your profane words around.

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